Positioning Vise

[bdext002]

Hi all,

I'd like to preface my rant by saying that I feel like this needs to be said by someone who has taken so much away (in knowledge and inspiration) from frequenting this forum.

I'm a bench jeweler at a small store who does a majority of the stone setting and engraving. A couple years ago I did a bright cut leaf engraving on the sides of an engagement ring. The customer was thrilled. The only person more thrilled was my boss, who proceeded to advertise my engraving ability to just about every John and/or Jane who walked through the door looking for custom work.

Since that day I have done countless engravings on countless rings, both practice and paid for. With every new job, my interest grew. I started looking at pictures of engravings. I purchased The Art of Engraving by JB Meek. I even filled my notebook with doodles of scrolls and lettering.

However, most all of my work being in precious metals, I have always been fascinated and, at times, even envious of those who engrave and inlay in steel. I came across this forum at the beginning of my, still young, career and hadn't taken the opportunity to really browse through the wealth of information it has, until recently.

Spending the past few months reading and learning about everything I could on this forum has inspired me to take the leap to start my own small operation out of my house. I won't be quitting my job or anything - I'm not THAT courageous and I do have to pay rent. I'd just like to start doing what I'm really passionate about, even if it's just for practice or gifts for my friends and family.

Now that I have written what appears to be turning into a novella of my transition into the world of engraving, I would like to wrap it up with a question and by saying thank you. All of you masters, journeymen and apprentices who take the time (and money) out of your day to post whatever knowledge you have bring new inspiration to craftsmen like me, who look to take that next step in the direction they want their careers to go.

NOW FOR THE QUESTION:

I have a Microblock currently because most of what I work on is jewelry. Now that I am getting into engraving larger pieces (knives, guns, etc.) I am looking at the GRS Positioning Vise. Does anyone have one of these who could share the benefits of using one or perhaps an alternative?


Bryce Dexter

 

[FANCYGUN]

If you are going to work under a microscope...I prefer the magnablock on a turntable (lazy susan) to center the work under the scope. Just faster and easier to manipulate

 

[dlilazteca]

If you are going to work under a microscope...I prefer the magnablock on a turntable (lazy susan) to center the work under the scope. Just faster and easier to manipulate

I totally agree with fancygun anything smaller you might have issues with firearms as that is all I engrave.

You see firearms have many faces / sides to work on, you at times have to lean your block at a very steep angle and since you're top heavy and if you block is not heavy enough it will slide and move on you as you try to engrave it

Hope this helps

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EBmH3SxyERk&feature=youtube_gdata_player

Carlos De La O III

 

[Sam]

I use the low profile vise on the turntable base. It's faster and easier to use than the Positioning Vise, but there are plenty of people who love 'em. Keep in mind that the Positioning Vise and/or the turntable system is for microscope use as Marty stated. They are both designed to keep the area you're engraving directly under the microscope's objective lens.

 

[DakotaDocMartin]

I use the low profile vise on the turntable base.

 

[bdext002]

I will be using this with a microscope. Thank you!


Bryce Dexter

 

[bdext002]

I do all of my engraving at my bench. Is there any good way to use the turntable system with my bench?


Bryce Dexter

 

[Texasgerd]

Bryce
Check our Carlos' drill press stand conversion for a table. You can put it under your work bench for clearance working under a microscope or leave it long to work at eye level. The option to go high or low is nice for working on jewlery or other fine work. The next best option is a GRS table mount or make your own if you're willing to tinker w/ metal.

I'll also echo the use of the low profile block placed on top of a good pottery turn table or engraving turn table. I actually use a beefy, solid aluminum, cake decorating turn table which works great. The magna block is great to use, but it is about 2-3" taller than the low profile. Those extra inches shaved off really help. Both have the same approx weight too. Just watch Craigs List and they come up now and again.

Welcome to the club.
Dan

 

[Andrew Biggs]

As you can see, it's a bit of a minefield. The micro block is great for jewellery, stone setting and really small item. But not flash for larger items.

What you are after with a vise is weight and mass. This stabilises your work and reduces vibration. Like all things there is a trade off between the vises. The choice of vise is important and underestimated by a lot of people.

The low profile vise is 20lbs....this is great for small objects right through to bigger items such as knives, gun parts etc etc. It doesn't cause fatigue pushing it around all day. I do most of my work with this.

The Magnablock is 30lbs......Great for gun frames and large awkward items that need good stabilisation and balance. Can cause fatigue pushing around all day but you get used to it and build up the arm muscles fairly quickly. The base also has to sit lower under a microscope. I use this for gun frames but it can tip over with long shotgun barrels.

Positioning vise is 42lbs........Great for really big items like shotgun barrels etc etc. It's a beast to push around all day and can cause fatigue. It's a BIG vise!!!

So you have a decision to make and a question to answer. What will 90% of your work be????

Well, in truth it will be small to medium/large size items. In which case the low profile or Magnablock will cover 90% to 95% of your work. If you are going to engrave really large items then the positioning vise will be your best bet.

Working with the microscope and vise may mean that you have to change your bench setup or have a dedicated engraving bench. The drill press stand is a great way to go. But do not make it removable. Set it up permanently as changing it around will get old real fast and you will spend a lot of time adjusting your microscope and centring your work.

If you are using a microscope and vise...........then you need a turntable. The reasons will become obvious when you set the whole thing up.

Always remember with this type of thing.......if you change one thing it has an effect on another. This is especially true when using a microscope.

Cheers
Andrew

 

[monk]

take a look at the thread on workbenches. there's a hundred varieties, all having one commonality-- they are designed to suit the individual, his or her body size, seated or standing work, and a regard must be made to allow working on long gun barrels. whatever you end up with, it must accomodate the work at hand, and with a special emphasis on working comfort. you have to work in a relaxed and comfort oriented way. aches , pains, and stiff muscles will be a constant companion if you don't work comfortably.
to answer your question- for some work i use a stereo zoom scope- or optivisor. either way, a positioning vise, riding on a bearing bed. releasing a ring, i can roll around on the bearing bed. put the ring back, and it's just the positioning vise.

 

[Brian Marshall]

"Flash", Andrew?

From you?


B.

 

[Andrew Biggs]

Hi Brian

Sorry, I don't understand.

Cheers
Andrew

 

[Brian Marshall]

"Flash" usually means just that... and is usually in bad taste - the work I have seen you post is a much better caliber.


B.

 

[Haraga.com]

"Flash" is a commonwealth word Brian. It will be ok when you get your coffee in the morning.

 

[Brian Marshall]

Guess "BLING" must be from somewhere else too, Leonard?

To me they are pretty hard to tell apart. But then my eyes are gettin' old...


B.


Had to give up the coffee.

 

[Andrew Biggs]

Hi Brian

Thanks for the compliment.

The English language is a funning thing. Down here, when you call something flash, it means pretty damn good. So if something isn't flash, then it's not that good.

When the kids were teenagers we did something together and they told me it bombed. Now in teenage speak that meant it was up there with shiznitz, which translated meant it was pretty damned good, or in my day, was cool. When I was a teenager, if something bombed it meant it was down the dunny or went down like a lead balloon. In other words, pretty bloody awful.

See, it's all so easy to understand

Cheers
Andrew

Oh yeah, just in case you have noticed. This has absolutely nothing to do with the topic at hand!!

 

[Brian Marshall]

I see now... what we need are 2 or 3 "English" dictionaries. Or maybe 4? Do the Aussies & New Zealanders have different definitions too?

I'm really missing that morning cup of coffee right now. Just thinking about parking in the driveway and driving on the parkway is confusing enough...


B.


Has there ever been a thread that stayed strictly with the topic at hand? Musta missed that one...

 

[dlilazteca]

Bryce
Check our Carlos' drill press stand conversion for a table. You can put it under your work bench for clearance working under a microscope or leave it long to work at eye level. The option to go high or low is nice for working on jewlery or other fine work. The next best option is a GRS table mount or make your own if you're willing to tinker w/ metal.

I'll also echo the use of the low profile block placed on top of a good pottery turn table or engraving turn table. I actually use a beefy, solid aluminum, cake decorating turn table which works great. The magna block is great to use, but it is about 2-3" taller than the low profile. Those extra inches shaved off really help. Both have the same approx weight too. Just watch Craigs List and they come up now and again.

Welcome to the club.
Dan

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dKAgcq-F96Y&feature=youtube_gdata_player

Carlos De La O III

 

[monk]

i know 3 people from australia. they all talk funny. but the blonde gal, i could listen to her all dAY ! WHEN SHE TALKS, IT'S LIKE LISTENING TO A BEAUTIFUL POEM SET TO MUSIC. my wife doesn't like me listening to her all that much ! go figger.

 

[Marcus Hunt]

I must admit to using a positioning vise and, depending on what you're cutting, it can be a very useful bit of kit. For flat work the turntable is absolutely fine and, as I'm now cutting more and more watches, I've just ordered one for myself. However, on awkward surfaces such as the detonating/fences of a shotgun or double rifle you need to cant the vise and often this will put the gun out of focus. Sliding the positioning vise is often enough to keep the surface focused without having to refocus the scope.

But boy, are they heavy and they are extremely tiring to use day in day out. Basically my neck and shoulders are shagged out from using one all these years especially from working on barrels. I am soooooo looking forward to concentrating on watches more in the future and using the turntable option over the positioning vise but, as I say, the positioning vise is not without it's benefits especially if you're working on double guns and barrels.