Metal inlay question

[Kevin P.]

I have a design in mind which would involve inlay.
I want to inlay 24K in platinum silver; it's to be a jewelry pin.
What gage of each would be appropriate?

The gold will be a gingko leaf. Nothing written in stone here so I'm open to all comments and suggestions.
I'm attaching a practice plate to see what the leaf might look like. I spent the last few hours on this.
Not too long after I began I thought I should be counting the cuts. Next time I will if i can find a counter that I can hit with my left foot.
Kevin P.

 

[d.soileau]

gold into PT... as a jeweler id solder or fuse it in place then do the engraved details.
maybe there are other ways i dont know of, but that seems the most secure to me.

 

[Kevin P.]

Thanks for the thought, but I think the method engravers use is more elegant.
There are probably tutorials here on the forum.
The more pertinent and critical question, for me is the gages of the two metals.

There's been very good info on the process I just have to track it down
Kevin P.

 

[jetta77]

platinum silver?

 

[Kevin P.]

ABI precious metals carries platinum as well as palladium silver. This will be my first experience with it.
I'm a jeweler who wants to be an engraver. I make high end jewelry mainly; so, with this design the platinum silver will up the perceived value and I just want to see what it's like. ABI has a web site that goes into some detail, Also, I think it requires special solder. But as I said this will be a first. I've heard from others that they're (ABI) helpful.
Kevin P.

 

[tundratrekers@mtaonline.n]

kevin,check out an baseball umpires counter.God Bless,mike

 

[Kevin P.]

Thanks Mike. I found "tallycounterstore.com" but haven't had time to check it out; but it looks like they have everything.
Kevin P.

 

[Kevin P.]

Jetta, I remembered after I posted that you're a jeweler.
This is not meant to be exclusinary(is that a word?) Could be interesting to others also.
I've been hearing about this alloy for at least a year. Recently a jeweler did a posting on his blog in which he used pt. silver to fabricate a pendant and ERs with chrysophrase cabs. It looks great and he liked the qualities of the alloy. So, I'm going to give it a try.
Almost everything I make is made on 'spec'. I've spent over 25 years building an audience at 'art' fairs. I spend a fair amount of time talking with perspective customers explaining the materials, etc. I only do custom for previous customers. The stone is opal in matrix fr QLD, Australia
Kevin P.

 

[jimzim75]

I haven't tried what your talking about. The general principal of inlay would hold true.
If your going to raise hooks to hold the 24k plate in place (I don't know how well that
would work, anyway.) The 24k plate has to be thick enough so they will not punch
though. So roughly .7mm or thicker.

The base would be the depth of your inlay plus a back strong enough that it will the
hammering of the inlay. So at least 1mm and probable better than that. I would make it
1.75mm, less if there is a weight problem.

This type of inlay is usually reserved for 18k white gold. At least that is what I've seen.

Isn't platinum silver kind of mushy?

 

[Kevin P.]

Hi Jim Why do you raise the question "raise hooks to hold the 24k plate in place (I don't know how well that would work, anyway.)"
The base will be supported on MDF while doing the inlay which should enough.to prevent distortion. !.75 for the base would be really heavy. 18KW would be a PIA from my limited experience. I don't know if PT silver is mushy; have you used this material.
Finally, almost all of what I say is conjecture; I should say extrapolation. I'm gleaning info from every available source. I have not done this before. More on the other thread.
Kevin P.

 

[jimzim75]

I only set diamonds in Pt silver and found it's not that much different than sterling in
the way it works. The use of raised hook or spur by using graver to raise is one way
keep the centre of a large sheet from raising and then fall out of base metal.

Because of the softness of PT silver it would have to have thicker cross section for
support or you would deform it by trying punch down the metal. The MDF is fine for
base but Pt Silver might still dish out.

You are almost better to simple do the leaf design in 24k, then cast the silver around it.
The 24k will not get any oxides so you not have to worry about black line or pour
junctions. You can also make it a bit thinner and lighter. You could also try PMC which
would be much easier.


PMC = Precious Metal Clay
MDF = Composite Wall board
PT = Platinum

 

[KCSteve]

Jim

That's a very interesting thought on using PMC for the background. Kevin could form and carve the leaf, then roll out the silver PMC and embed the leaf in it. I'm thinking if he cut some inlay channels on the back of the leaf that the PMC would flow / be pressed into them and help hold the piece together.

Fire it with the gold side down to help with the bonding or gold side up to make it easier to keep the raised edges where he wants them?

Intriguing possibilities...

 

[Kevin P.]

"Because of the softness of PT silver it would have to have thicker cross section for
support or you would deform it by trying punch down the metal. The MDF is fine for
base but Pt Silver might still dish out."
Jim I see your point about the softness; but then isn't 24K even softer? Even at that, some other white metal might be the way to go. Platinum is pretty close to the gold spot isn't it?
You've touched on one of my most deeply held prejudices: I hate PMC and have never used it and won't ever use it. Irrational, eh?
Kevin P.

 

[jimzim75]

It just another form of metal. It hasn't been something that you would see of the
Café, but it most likely will be. Since we have the ability to make great master molds
to form it, PMC is something to consider when designing jewellery. Limiting your pallet is
short sighted.

Pt silver is closer to 24k gold than it is to steel. 18k white can be wickedly sharp and
tough. Cold Rolled steel and 18k in feel are not that far apart. This has to do with nickles
content in the 18k. The tougher the metal the thinner the cross section needed for inlay.

 

[Kevin P.]

Jim, Please don't take my comment about PMC as something personal. One should never say never,

I do want to say that your comments gave me a push forward in my project. I don't know why I didn't consider other 'white metals'; they make more sense.
I have used 14K palladium white gold before. It seems more workable to me than regular white gold. It makes more sense. Anyhow Pt silver is definitely out.
Kevin P.

 

[jimzim75]

Palladium white gold is another great choice as far as how it works. It's color is grayish
but since this isn't a engagement ring that shouldn't be a problem.

I'm looking forward to seeing the entire design, not just the leaf but how you frame it.
Post some pictures when it's finished.

Jim

 

[Kevin P.]

Jim Thanks for all the input; it really helps and is useful. I changed the white metal. Somehow Pt silver got locked into my head even though it didn't make sense.
After all my mouthing off I will definitely post the results.
Kevin P.