Lindsays New Sharpening System

[McAhron]

This is not about one tool versus another!!!!
I felt compelled to write this as the Linday Sharpener is a wonderful product.When I recieved it I was able to take a square blank graver and put all facets on it in less than 15 minutes.Touch-ups take less than a minute.The system is amazingly accurate,fast,and inexpensive.The gravers line up identicaly each and every time the graver touches the stone,my dual angle is always off a little every time an angle is changed.I cant honestly think of any reason why every engraver from novice to pro couldnt benefit from this tool.Even those with power hones.I own several GRS products and like them so this isnt about competition its about functionality.If GRS had developed this then I would be making the same recommendations.

 

[ddushane]

I've been wanting to get me one. Dwayne

 

[pilkguns]

I have to agree that this a very intuitive tool. I think it makes the essentials of tools geometry much easier for a beginner to understand and its easy to exactly duplicate your previous angles althogh this is of doubtful benefit. The Dual Angle fixture is obviously more versatile but it is much easier to get confused or maybe just in a hurry and put a facet where you really did'nt want it. Not that I have ever done that ...... oh no.
The fact that the angles vary a degree or so on subsequent sharpenings make no real difference whatsover. Many engravers around the world for over 800 years have sharpened gravers strictly by feel and eyeball, myself included, and I would bet in some cases of sharpening performed by hand, that there might be 5 -10 degrees variance from one to another with no real effect on the masters performance.

Paul Hamler, the inventor of the Lindsay sharpening fixture, will be at the Engrave-In talking about making his miniature tools and doing a casting demonstration. Don't miss it.

 

[pilkguns]

The fact that the angles vary a degree or so on subsequent sharpenings make no real difference whatsover. .

Just to be clear this variance is not due to any mechanical looseness in the tool, only the your eye's imperfect ability to line up the index marks exactly the same each time. But I doubt even that you are more than half a degree or so off each time.

 

[KCSteve]

That's an advantage of the OptiVisor - I wear mine when I'm sharpening so I can line things up more precisely - at least when I'm going for an angle there is a mark for.

 

[CJ Allan]

I'll be ordering a Lindsay sharpening system in the near future...

I just got a new GRS dual Angle ..and it's a hassle to set Flats in ...have to eyeball em each time .......

 

[John B.]

CJ, if you already have the GRS power hone and post may I suggest that you consider adding their standard sharpening fixture head.
It makes sharpening or forming flats and the standard 90 degree gravers a snap.
It is very fast to use and creates or touches the standard lift/clearance faces dead-on every time.
I use two of them and leave one set up to my standard face angle and the other set to my lift.
The gravers either fit into the V-groove or on the flats without adjustment.
Just my thoughts, John B.

 

[fegarex]

CJ,
I assume you are talking about a "commercial type flat" and not one made from a 3/32 square?
I don't have any trouble if you just "wiggle" the flat as you tighten it and it seems to find square. I don't know for sure but I think the other system will only sharpen 3/32 squares as a flat and not the commercial made variety. I may be wrong on this but that was what I was told.

 

[Sam]

I use the wiggle method as well to align flat gravers in my dual angle fixture. Narrow flats are easy to align perfectly. When I sharpen a wide #42 flat a little more care is needed when mounting the graver.

 

[KCSteve]

Marty (FancyGun) taught us a trick in class for the flats and other 'not square' gravers:

Set the ceramic hone disk on the PowerHone.
Set the dual-angle jig to 0 / 0.
Put the QC collet for the graver in the jig and set the top of it flat on the ceramic hone.
Tighten the jig up and then adjust to the angles you want.
As long as the graver has a flat, straight top edge you can use this method. Well, you can use it for gravers mounted in QC collets or other round holders. I bet it'd work for making a graver out of a saw blade or other informal source.

 

[Ozgraver]

I've spent thirty plus years sharpening various metal-working tools, turning tools, woodworking chisels and carving gouges on a daily basis and I've seen apprentices try and short-circuit their training using various guides and tool holders etc. (usually with negative or detrimental results). However, I would have to say the Lindsay Sharpening System is without doubt the best method of sharpening gravers that I've seen.

I can grind-in five blank gravers in under an hour and thereafter, it only takes a few minutes to freshen them up every so often with a few licks on one of the diamond 'stones'. I wouldn't even consider another sharpening set-up and would recommend the Lindsay Sharpening System to beginners and professionals alike. It really is that good!

 

[Bama]

Lindsay System

I have used Steve's sharpening system for the Lindsay Point and it is very easy to use and quick. I do like the Lindsay Point as it cuts very well speaking from a beginners view point. I have a GRS power hone and a duel angle sharpening fixture also and this is a very good system. I think with the GRS system you have to watch what you are doing when you set the angles to get a good consistant point which you do not have to do with the Lindsay system. The draw back is with the Lindsay is you get the same point each time, and I can see as I gain knowledge that there are many ways to sharpen a graver to get different results, with the Lindsay system you do not have that flexability. For beginners the same point is a good thing and this point can be used for probably 90% of what you do. The GRS system can give you a great number of different angles for more gravers, it's just a little more complicated so you have to pay more attention when you sharpen. I have no doubt that there are guys that do this for a living that can sharpen and get great results without a fixture but I am not one of them.

 

[Ozgraver]

The draw back is with the Lindsay is you get the same point each time, and I can see as I gain knowledge that there are many ways to sharpen a graver to get different results, with the Lindsay system you do not have that flexability. For beginners the same point is a good thing and this point can be used for probably 90% of what you do. The GRS system can give you a great number of different angles for more gravers...

The Lyndsay Sharpening System has many preset angles...probably far more than most people would ever use.

 

[Andrew Biggs]

Again, my best advice to anyone learning how to engrave is don’t buy into, and start limiting your creativity with “this is the only thing you will ever need†or “this is the only way to do it†type of thinking.

The Dual angle sharpening system is a very well made excellent piece of kit that can be used for a great range of sharpening requirements. The fact that it can be rotated to any angle and fit any type of graver makes it an extremley versatile tool.

The Lindsay sharpening system is a very well made, excellent piece of kit for making the Lindsay patented parallel points, knife and flats.

Both sharpening systems do what they are designed to do very well. As you gain experience and confidence with your engraving you’ll want to start experimenting with different angles and graver shapes. In some cases the decision will be forced on you by the job you are working on. Experimentation is part of the engraving process and by limiting your thinking to one thing you are selling yourself short.

There’s a whole lot more to engraving than just a tool and sharpening system. The hardness of the metal you are working on, the contours of the surface, the harness/brittleness of your gravers, the finish of the cut……..all have a say in how you approach the job.

As a beginner you are very conscious of getting your angles exactly right every time and duplicating everything exactly the same. After a while, once you become a bit more confident with your skills and relax a little then you begin to realise that close enough is good enough and a couple of degrees difference isn’t going to make a blind bit of difference to anything.

Cheers
Andrew

 

[pilkguns]

As you gain experience and confidence with your engraving you’ll want to start experimenting with different angles and graver shapes. In some cases the decision will be forced on you by the job you are working on.

Well said again Andrew. This is an area that having the dual angle fixture excels because can bump a setting up 2 1/2 degrees or so at time, and see really what it does to your cutting and of course if you write it down, you can easily reset the fixture to make the same graver over and over again if you find a scenario that you like.

 

[Dave London]

Humm
Just to be a curmudgon WHY

 

[Andrew Biggs]

Hi Dave

You're not a curmudgon are you? I had to Google that one to find out what it meant!!!

Why what?

Cheers
Andrew

 

[pilkguns]

I've been accused of being a curmudgeon on more than one occasion, but I'm with Andrew, why what?

 

[Billzach]

I,ve both the grs dual angle fixture and power hone and the lindsay system, i like them both and use them both..To me a engraver,s work speaks to me more then the tools they use, when i see nice engraving i don,t think about what tools they use, i think about the gift that person has as a engraver..

 

[Sam]

There are many times when I loosen the locking screw(s) and rock my fixture when sharpening modified (rounded) flat gravers and the curved bellied flat gravers I use for brightcutting and script lettering. I've seen some engravers put a slight radius on square graver heels, too. These are very valuable functions of the Dual Angle fixture that I can't be without.

As a side note, last week I was looking at some specialized onglette gravers used for extremely deep miniature scrolls for watch engraving which had the faces tilted a few degrees to the right and left for clockwise and counter-clockwise cutting. A fixture in which the graver can be dialed-in to any angle would be critical for this type of tool.

... when i see nice engraving i don,t think about what tools they use, i think about the gift that person has as a engraver..

Bill, you are a wise and insightful man. I really do admire you, and I'm not talking about engraving this time.

Sam