Find the 7 differences

[Arnaud Van Tilburgh]

Fancygun don't take my quote out of the context. I tried to find where I didn't respect the rules in those lines that were deleted.
I think we all can agree that editing ones post is not nice. That because then it changes the whole context and meaning of the post of the author.
And if it has to do with the poor vocabulary because one uses American movie English, that doesn't mean his attitude is not correct. I believe this has become an international place where all people from different cultures and opinions can meet to share the same passion, engraving.
Those who participate in an active way make this place to what it is. If only allowed to write down what moderators allow, it is Easter to write a book. So I'm convinced, and sure some will disagree and that is what makes it interesting, that I contribute a lot to this forum. A cafe were everyone is drinking coffee or the, only saying "yes it is nice weather today" to me that is a less interesting cafe to meet people.
So once again, let's agree we can disagree.
Is it bad discussing things? Isn't it what lead to inspiration and new point of views? Who wants a world were the sun always shine and we all agree on the same, without new ideas as that is a peacefully place were nothing ever changes.
We all are different and that is a good thing in my opinion. And perhaps some of you prefer a never changing world, but that is not realistic, we have to anticipate on what is going on in the world to renew strategy. As I'm part of that world, what is wrong with it when I participate a bit to change the world a bit in a positive way. If not done in the past, perhaps black Americans you when I was a kid called ******s, couldn't even participate on forums. And a lot more examples I can give.

Arnaud

 

[Arnaud Van Tilburgh]

So is is that wrong having one around trying to blow against the wind?

Arnaud

 

[Jeroen]

Well Fancygun, I agree: when someone visits my home, they have to behave according to my house rules.
Comparing a forum to a home, on the other hand, isn't correct. I don't know about you, but when I don't like what someone does in my home, I will tell him or here, but I won't tell the whole wide world (the www) how wrong this person is. And I certainly wouldn't do that without telling why I think so.
Because: that's only how I think.

And I believe that's what has happened here, since this isn't a home or a house. It's the internet, the world wide web.
Starting a thread such as "I received an email", was like telling the whole world: "see how wrong one can be, tell me I'm right".
Through the thread Mike became 'the wrong one', and the main idea became: "you're wrong, what do you know about it" and later on: "prove us you have the right to speak". That became rough, so the thread was closed without conclusion, only two opponents.
And after that Arnaud was stigmatised as 'the one that always makes trouble in our home', whilst he only tried to get the forum back to what it's meant for: engraving and designing. And that happened without anybody knowing how he did not respect the rules.

So Sam and Andrew, this may be a tip for you as moderators: if you believe someone posts something "inappropriate" or "not according the rules", and you cut in the post, close it or delete it, let the posting member know what exactly is wrong whit/in it.
It's like raising children: you can hit them when they don't behave, they will be 'out' for a while, so your home will be peaceful for a while, but the child won't really know how to avoid the next beating unless you explain. On a forum a little pm might be sufficient to do so.

In my opinion, it's too easy said "I heard it coming, so I closed/deleted/changed it". I don't know at what moment it was heard coming, but I heard it coming from the start...
You know when your home is most and certainly in peace? When you let nobody in. But to some, that is boring. Or should I say: not interesting. Imagine a café without people.

I wasn't goiing to take part in this discussion, as there is not one right answer and as I agree that we all should be able to agree to disagree,
but simplifying it all to : "It's your own fault, you didn't respect the rules" just isn't correct.

Jeroen

 

[Crazy Horse]

I don't think Arnaud was out of line. Sam is a dictator of sorts. After all, it is his site and he rules supreme. There is no democracy on a forum. Nothing wrong with that. But I do think that some people are awfully thin skinned.
We should all remember that not all of us speak American English, or the King's English, as the case may be. Some come from European countries and speak 2 or more languages, and may very well have different interpretations of word meanings. After all, how many of us speak a second language fluently? (And who among us speaks 3 languages?)

Perhaps a little bit of tolerance might be in order.

Rather than argue, maybe those who wish to condem others would better spend their efforts at posting some of their latest engravings. It seems that a lot of the pros who post here post very little of their work.

 

[fegarex]

I guess I am having a hard time understanding a lot of these posts. This forum is owned and operated by Sam and he chooses the moderators.
He has stated rules. This is not a club or a guild that everyone has an equal vote on how it is run. No one is required to post anything or for that matter, read anything. If you don't like it, don't let the door hit you on the behind on the way out. Nobody is making anyone stay here.
The software is availablle out there for forums and if you think this one isn't doing it right, you can always start your own.

 

[Arnaud Van Tilburgh]

Rex, I have to lay eggs here

arnaud

 

[fegarex]

Arnaud,
Not really sure what that means but I guess it doesn't matter.

 

[Christian DeCamillis]

Rex,

This is an interesting reply you made above.

A little history of the Cafe may well explain why some things are the way they are.

When Sam started the forum at that time the i graver. I received a personal phone call from him asking me to join and participate. There were others that received a similar call I am sure. He wanted to get the forum moving and needed some people that could help him get it rolling because there were a couple of other competing forums out there. I graciously accepted and I feel I contributed plenty as many others have and still do. There were the usual disagreements and arguments over various subjects like tools and such. The forum grew and kept growing It was because Sam got the ball rolling and others like myself possibly even yourself who were asked by Sam to participate to help make it what it is today we participated and took the time to help anyone who asked for help.
After sometime things grew so large that he needed help and asked others to help moderate. At some point everything changed and suddenly actions by myself and others were deemed unacceptable. In fact i remember one incident where someone was attacking what I was saying and you emailed me and said you better get in there and defend yourself. I am sure I still have the email if you would like to see it.

Now that the forum has grown so large because of Sam's initial idea to start it and those of us who were invited to participate we didn't join because we just wanted to we were asked to, have had issues with things that have occurred we are told that there isn't time for helping with your issue and when requests have been made to do something about the hostile treatment from others at times, there is either no response or the response is not in your favor.

All I know is that it is easy to forget about those humble beginnings and the people who helped in the formation of this fine forum.
So when i hear responses like if you don't like it leave you didn't have to join etc... I always think to myself I was asked to be here and now that I am not needed , who cares. so if some don't understand why things have come to be the way they are here is an explanation.

So as you suggest i did start my own forum.

Chris

 

[Crazy Horse]

Eggs hatch to give new life.

 

[Arnaud Van Tilburgh]

Arnaud,
Not really sure what that means but I guess it doesn't matter.

Sure it matters, like Crazy Horse translated, eggs are like new creative ideas, I got more than I can work out. So I'm sharing the extras

arnaud