jb1983
Elite Cafe Member
Hello, when I am engraving a boarder line in a gold ring the gold crinkles along the line I cut. I am using a square graver to make the cut. Any suggestions on how prevent this?
Thanks
Thanks
Question: Engraving ?
- Thread starter jb1983
- Start date
Brian Marshall
~ Elite 1000 Member ~
Use younger gold? Won't show the wrinkles/crinkles as much 
Seriously, we need more specific information... What color, what karat, and maybe even what alloy are you cutting? If you are engraving cast products, rather than milled - you can expect all kinds of anomalies. Including "crinkles"...
Brian
Seriously, we need more specific information... What color, what karat, and maybe even what alloy are you cutting? If you are engraving cast products, rather than milled - you can expect all kinds of anomalies. Including "crinkles"...
Brian
Dulltool
Elite Cafe Member
Brian.... ya had me going for a second..... I was thinking what the heck is "younger gold"
1 possibility is that your graver isn't sharpened correctly. when done correctly, all facets of the graver need a smooth, highly polished surface. you can rough cut with a 6oo grit, then go over with at least 1000 grit for a polish. actually 1200 or 2000 grit is even better for that. assure that all facet angles where they meet are sharp and crisp to the eye. if the edges of the face angle are rough, you'll likely get bad cuts.
Haraga.com
~ Elite 1000 Member ~
Maybe Brian meant Virgin Gold.
jb1983
Elite Cafe Member
I cast all my rings, I use 14ky and 14kw. Now that I think of it I just finished up a fabrication job and this did not happen. When I use my 120 I dont run in to this. I will take more time when sharpening the graver next time and see if that works.
Thanks
Jake
Thanks
Jake
Brian Marshall
~ Elite 1000 Member ~
You'll probably find that casting your product is the problem. The grain structure is loose in a casting, rolled sheet and drawn wire are compressed.
Using identical alloy - perform an experiment. Using whatever alloy you are having a problem with, cast a piece of 18 ga. wax sheet and polish it. (as best you can)
Just trying to polish a piece of cast "sheet" will probably reveal a lot of imperfections before you even engrave it...
Then roll an ingot made of the same alloy down to a similar size and stop at 18 guage.
Engrave a bit on each of them and see the difference. Especially under a microscope.
Castings can have hidden voids, included crystals from using acetylene gas, imperfect mixing, and damage from quenching or not quenching depending on the alloy.
It even happens occasionally on factory milled products. It's rare enough that when you get a bad piece they usually try tell you it has to do with how the planets were aligned.
White gold alloys in the US commonly contain nickel. Nasty stuff on it's own.
Brian
Using identical alloy - perform an experiment. Using whatever alloy you are having a problem with, cast a piece of 18 ga. wax sheet and polish it. (as best you can)
Just trying to polish a piece of cast "sheet" will probably reveal a lot of imperfections before you even engrave it...
Then roll an ingot made of the same alloy down to a similar size and stop at 18 guage.
Engrave a bit on each of them and see the difference. Especially under a microscope.
Castings can have hidden voids, included crystals from using acetylene gas, imperfect mixing, and damage from quenching or not quenching depending on the alloy.
It even happens occasionally on factory milled products. It's rare enough that when you get a bad piece they usually try tell you it has to do with how the planets were aligned.
White gold alloys in the US commonly contain nickel. Nasty stuff on it's own.
Brian
Last edited:
jb1983
Elite Cafe Member
Thanks for the help Brian.
I cast most my rings in white gold, its trickie just to cast the stuff. You are dead on how it looks under the scope. Its not that my customer would ever know.... just bothers me. You seem to have a world of smithing Knowledge.
Thanks for the info.
Jake
I cast most my rings in white gold, its trickie just to cast the stuff. You are dead on how it looks under the scope. Its not that my customer would ever know.... just bothers me. You seem to have a world of smithing Knowledge.
Thanks for the info.
Jake
Christian DeCamillis
Elite Cafe Member
Jake
What you are experiencing with cast gold is normal. The metal tends to build up in front of the cutting point and then the point cuts through. i am sure that after your first cut the next ones are better. I don't know if your hand pushing. But if you are using a pneumatic handpiece I would recommend slowing down your cutting speed as much as possible. . Make sure your graver is very sharp. Use a lower face angle no more that 45 degrees even 40 or 35 would be best. Part of what's happening is exactly what Brian already told you. Yes he does have a lot of knowledge and experience with smithing. The other thing that is also happening is you are pushing the metal instead of cutting it. Slower will work better.
When metal is soft cutting slower will help a lot. The same thing is true with stainless. With cast metal you will need to make more than one cut to get a good result.
Chris
What you are experiencing with cast gold is normal. The metal tends to build up in front of the cutting point and then the point cuts through. i am sure that after your first cut the next ones are better. I don't know if your hand pushing. But if you are using a pneumatic handpiece I would recommend slowing down your cutting speed as much as possible. . Make sure your graver is very sharp. Use a lower face angle no more that 45 degrees even 40 or 35 would be best. Part of what's happening is exactly what Brian already told you. Yes he does have a lot of knowledge and experience with smithing. The other thing that is also happening is you are pushing the metal instead of cutting it. Slower will work better.
When metal is soft cutting slower will help a lot. The same thing is true with stainless. With cast metal you will need to make more than one cut to get a good result.
Chris
oiseau metal arts
Elite Cafe Member
i had a similar problem with a batch of silver beads. im not sure exactly what i did wrong in the casting, but i ended up scrapping a batch os 20 of them. they were all VERY grainy and wouldnt engrave well. kinda like feta cheese.
mitch
~ Elite 1000 Member ~
- Joined
- Jul 23, 2007
- Messages
- 2,636
not to be confused with "Chaste Silver" (my wife & i were in the V&A years ago and wandered past a tour group as the guide was making some mention of "chased silver". i whispered to my wife, you think he'd appreciate this uncouth Yank asking, "Is 'Chaste Silver' kinda like 'Virgin Wool'?"
Mitch, Awsome!
jb1983
Elite Cafe Member
Thank you all for the info.
Sponsors
