Mercury/Gold
- Thread starter Glenn
- Start date
silverchip
~ Elite 1000 Member ~
Glenn
I've never heard that you could get pure gold this way, mercury will not dissolve gold or any other metal.the ancient Egyptians used to amalgamate gold with mercury and then use nitric acid to etch the surface of other metals then apply the amalgamation to that,then with heat evaporate the mercury and leave the gold behind. this process would bond the gold to the other surface and it was then burnished to produce a smooth surface. It is called mercury guilding and is outlawed today for obvious reasons.:no::no::no:
I've never heard that you could get pure gold this way, mercury will not dissolve gold or any other metal.the ancient Egyptians used to amalgamate gold with mercury and then use nitric acid to etch the surface of other metals then apply the amalgamation to that,then with heat evaporate the mercury and leave the gold behind. this process would bond the gold to the other surface and it was then burnished to produce a smooth surface. It is called mercury guilding and is outlawed today for obvious reasons.:no::no::no:
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It's the method that is used extensively by dredge miners in the Amazon. Given the education level of largely stone age natives, the process can't be all that sophisticated. Ignorance is bliss until the effects have to be dealt with by future generations.
tundratrekers@mtaonline.n
Elite Cafe Member
There are some real idiots that still use this in Alaska. Don't be one.
Come and meet some of them,that alone will cause you to reconsider.
If you know the danger ,WHY even contemplate it?:beatup::no:
mike
Come and meet some of them,that alone will cause you to reconsider.
If you know the danger ,WHY even contemplate it?:beatup::no:
mike
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rod
~ Elite 1000 Member ~
Glenn,
I recently watched some Youtube video of a detailed reclamation technique that was not mercury based, can't remember the link, but a search would bring it up?
Dave gives a good description of "gilding" which was used very expertly up until recently, as we know electroplating is not an ancient technique. I had not heard that it was outlawed? Done sensibly it has worked for centuries, although I do accept that mercury poisoning was not fully recognized widely, until recently.... we would all be allowed to play with puddles of mercury in the science room at high school, and most of us have been chewing on it, if you have a mouth full of amalgam tooth fillings.
Regarding amalgams of mercury and silver, you would have to heat your teeth up to 260 Centigrade to release the mercury.
Gilding is a more tenacious gold surface that electroplating, as the gold diffused a little into the silver forming a silver/gold alloy. I think the process is well known:
Use filings of 24 k gold, not dust, mix with mercury until a cottage cheese consistency results
Wrap in chamois leather, twist and squeeze to separate out excess mercury.
Use various techniques, as Dave describes, to prepare the bronze or silver to accept the gold mercury 'putty', iron wire brushes help.
Once the gilding has taken, of course the result is a silvery bright.
Now, this is where it gets unhealthy if you are not knowledgeable, heating the gilded object will drive off the mercury to reveal the gold colour, BUT.... the mercury vapor fumes, which start to evaporate at about 260 C, are highly toxic.
So, do this in a fume cupboard, or outdoors with a wind or fan moving the air in a safe direction.
There are many, many things that sensible people would not do, like drinking gasoline, etc....not good for your body.
The problem was, in olden times these processes were not well understood, although people have always had an eye for what does and does not work, you do not need the modern scientific method to learn that eating some plants will poison you, and others help you.
In our modern age, reading Celleni's gilding instructions are a bit alarming, paraphrasing... if you are feeling ill after gilding, eat lots of garlic (!)
Dave, if you have a reference for the ancient Egyptians doing mercury gilding, I would like to have it, as I have an interest in the long timeline of metal techniques. best of all was when the Spaniards were snookered by the Incas, after bold but catastrophic results on ****aro's band, large cargoes of 'gold' were shipped back to Spain to discover the metal was very low alloy gold. Spain could not believe that such "savages" as the Incas could have developed such a sophisticated technique
Rod
I recently watched some Youtube video of a detailed reclamation technique that was not mercury based, can't remember the link, but a search would bring it up?
Dave gives a good description of "gilding" which was used very expertly up until recently, as we know electroplating is not an ancient technique. I had not heard that it was outlawed? Done sensibly it has worked for centuries, although I do accept that mercury poisoning was not fully recognized widely, until recently.... we would all be allowed to play with puddles of mercury in the science room at high school, and most of us have been chewing on it, if you have a mouth full of amalgam tooth fillings.
Regarding amalgams of mercury and silver, you would have to heat your teeth up to 260 Centigrade to release the mercury.
Gilding is a more tenacious gold surface that electroplating, as the gold diffused a little into the silver forming a silver/gold alloy. I think the process is well known:
Use filings of 24 k gold, not dust, mix with mercury until a cottage cheese consistency results
Wrap in chamois leather, twist and squeeze to separate out excess mercury.
Use various techniques, as Dave describes, to prepare the bronze or silver to accept the gold mercury 'putty', iron wire brushes help.
Once the gilding has taken, of course the result is a silvery bright.
Now, this is where it gets unhealthy if you are not knowledgeable, heating the gilded object will drive off the mercury to reveal the gold colour, BUT.... the mercury vapor fumes, which start to evaporate at about 260 C, are highly toxic.
So, do this in a fume cupboard, or outdoors with a wind or fan moving the air in a safe direction.
There are many, many things that sensible people would not do, like drinking gasoline, etc....not good for your body.
The problem was, in olden times these processes were not well understood, although people have always had an eye for what does and does not work, you do not need the modern scientific method to learn that eating some plants will poison you, and others help you.
In our modern age, reading Celleni's gilding instructions are a bit alarming, paraphrasing... if you are feeling ill after gilding, eat lots of garlic (!)
Dave, if you have a reference for the ancient Egyptians doing mercury gilding, I would like to have it, as I have an interest in the long timeline of metal techniques. best of all was when the Spaniards were snookered by the Incas, after bold but catastrophic results on ****aro's band, large cargoes of 'gold' were shipped back to Spain to discover the metal was very low alloy gold. Spain could not believe that such "savages" as the Incas could have developed such a sophisticated technique
Rod
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qndrgnsdd
Elite Cafe Member
The process for felting Beaver fur to make hats used mercury. This the origin of the phrase "Mad as a hatter". If you have the opportunity to use ANY process using mercury and heat, Please pass it up!
rod
~ Elite 1000 Member ~
Good advice, qnd,
Mercury and heat should have a big warning label.
Regarding body temperature mercury in our mouths, I wonder what Cellini would think about so many of us chewing on our amalgam fillings for much of our lives? It is a divided subject of debate that fills many internet sites, and one worth looking at carefully.
Rod
Mercury and heat should have a big warning label.
Regarding body temperature mercury in our mouths, I wonder what Cellini would think about so many of us chewing on our amalgam fillings for much of our lives? It is a divided subject of debate that fills many internet sites, and one worth looking at carefully.
Rod
Andrew Biggs
Moderator
Hi Rod
It's only when the fillings in your mouth start picking up radio signals that it becomes a problem
Cheers
Andrew
It's only when the fillings in your mouth start picking up radio signals that it becomes a problem
Cheers
Andrew
Doc Mark
~ Elite 1000 Member ~
I'm not at all familiar with the amalgamation of gold/mercury as I am with the basic silver/mercury used for over 100 years as a dental restorative. Without getting into the ongoing debate over the merits and/or safety concerns about silver amalgams, just believe me when I say I've had some in my mouth for over half a century and will not be removing them in the near future. And note that the claims of dental amalgams causing Multiple Sclerosis is absolutely unfounded, irresponsible B.S.!
Having now vented a bit, I put my 2 cents on the side of caution. There is no way I would vaporize elemental Mercury without a massive amount of safety equipment, including hoods, fans, and respirators!
Having now vented a bit, I put my 2 cents on the side of caution. There is no way I would vaporize elemental Mercury without a massive amount of safety equipment, including hoods, fans, and respirators!
tundratrekers@mtaonline.n
Elite Cafe Member
Where do you think those vapors go when they are released?
Just because you wore protective gear,what about neighbors,wild life and everything else.
We are living in a bubble, if you will,that stuff is floating around here somewhere.
I think it irresponsible to try and teach someone how to use mercury, on the forum.
Too easy to misinterpret it.
Go and take some chemistry at the university.
mike
Just because you wore protective gear,what about neighbors,wild life and everything else.
We are living in a bubble, if you will,that stuff is floating around here somewhere.
I think it irresponsible to try and teach someone how to use mercury, on the forum.
Too easy to misinterpret it.
Go and take some chemistry at the university.
mike
Haraga.com
~ Elite 1000 Member ~
You are funny Mike.
rod
~ Elite 1000 Member ~
Thank you for a balanced dentist's view, Mark,
Clearly no one is going to be heating up mercury, and I have no plans to have my fillings removed. Thank you also, Bob. The historical view is also interesting. Mercury, as Bob writes, has always been with us. Unfortunately, in San Francisco Bay, it will be with us in dense deposits. It was available in the region to be refined, and vast quantities used in the gold rush days. Since then, the rivers have washed it into the mud of the shallow Bay where it will be lodged for a very long time, experts expect it to percolate up the food chain. On the bright side of life, our average life span is increasing! Be prudent, be happy.
Rod
Clearly no one is going to be heating up mercury, and I have no plans to have my fillings removed. Thank you also, Bob. The historical view is also interesting. Mercury, as Bob writes, has always been with us. Unfortunately, in San Francisco Bay, it will be with us in dense deposits. It was available in the region to be refined, and vast quantities used in the gold rush days. Since then, the rivers have washed it into the mud of the shallow Bay where it will be lodged for a very long time, experts expect it to percolate up the food chain. On the bright side of life, our average life span is increasing! Be prudent, be happy.
Rod
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Red Green
Elite Cafe Member
- Joined
- Aug 19, 2011
- Messages
- 391
Rod,
Excess of the past may be treasures of the future. The bay will be ‘mined’ for its heavy metals and other valuables in the not too far future, it is inevitable, hopefully without damaging some future environment or causing other unforeseen problems. Man will continue to expand his knowledge and domain, we grow or die stagnation is death for mankind. Our greed is ingrained into our very soul we will destroy everything to gain more, I give you Easter Island as a example.
Bob
Excess of the past may be treasures of the future. The bay will be ‘mined’ for its heavy metals and other valuables in the not too far future, it is inevitable, hopefully without damaging some future environment or causing other unforeseen problems. Man will continue to expand his knowledge and domain, we grow or die stagnation is death for mankind. Our greed is ingrained into our very soul we will destroy everything to gain more, I give you Easter Island as a example.
Bob
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