Question: is it OK to use different elements together ?

[yakob]

Hi everybody,

Please forgive me for my bad English.

l wonder if it is OK to use different kind of elements together

For example can l use German scroll , English scroll and Western scroll together along with other kind of ornemantel elements ?

Thanks ....

 

[Sam]

I would say yes, as long as the elements don't appear to be mismatched. The design should be harmonious.

 

[Roger Bleile]

Sometimes a larger style of scroll is overlayed on a smaller style. European guns sometimes use fine English scroll as a form of background for other elements. Examples below.

Also many German, Austrian, and Belgian guns have a combination of one style of scroll on the action and a different style on the fences or bolsters. Such as German scroll on the action and thistle on the bolsters or acanthus leaf on the fences and English scroll on the action. Oak leaf is also combined with scroll ornament.

 

[John P. Anderson]

It's only my opinion, I think it's in bad taste in any form of art to combine to many styles. At the very least it's difficult to pull it off. Personally I think some of the examples that Roger posted look busy and don't stand the test of time. They look antique and designed by committee. I do like the ones that combine just a couple or maybe three styles at most.

Of the pictures Roger posted I don't like #1.
I do like #2 & 3.
#4 I kind of like but I think it would be better with more consistency and a different balance of background/foreground.
#5 I don't like. To many styles.

I was taught in page design not to use over three styles of fonts on a page and I think it applies in all forms of art.

But that's just my opinion..... Yours may be different and I'm ok with that.

John

 

[metalchipper]

Hello yakob,

Yes I think it is OK to use different types of designs and the examples that Roger Bleile gave are good.
When we look at a flower garden or an arrangement of flowers, are they all only one kind?
Sometimes, but the most interesting are a complimentary mix of different kinds.

Just my 2 cents worth.
Mark

 

[yakob]

I really thank you all of you

Mr. Bleile thanks for the photos,

 

[Sam]

Thanks for your photos, Roger. For some reason I was thinking elements in the same scroll as opposed to different scroll styles combined as you have shown.

Winston Churchill does wonderful combinations arabesque and english scroll and does it to perfection. So yeah, it can definitely be done.

 

[mitch]

if the quality of the work is excellent, one can pull off the feat of mixing styles better, but that probably goes for pretty much anything artistic- fashion, music, painting, furniture, etc. it is very common for a gun, especially doubles, to have deep relief sculpting/carving in certain areas (i.e. fences & top lever) while the rest of the piece is done in another style. in this particular case, the sculpting is used to emphasize the depth & form on parts that are more 3-dimensional, and comes off as an accent, rather than a separate type of decoration. i've used this combination reasonably successfully on various works over the years.

 

[Roger Bleile]

John,

My favorites of the examples I posted are #1 and #5, especially #1 (by Jean Marie Martens). This just proves that much of this issue is a matter of taste. It also points to the fact that being able to design and execute a variety of styles of ornament is useful because our patrons will have various points of view.

RB

 

[mdengraver]

Roger,

Thanks for sharing these complex designs. Looking at these examples is quite captivating by there intricacy and design, quite mind boggling!

 

[Christian DeCamillis]

Jacob,

It's a great question and my opinion is yes mix it any way you please. It's art express what you want. Just look around do you see only one kind of tree growing or one kind of flower and grass of course not. Nature is a mixture of flora and fauna. That's what makes it so interesting. As I look out my window I can count 8 different trees so many different grasses or weeds if you will along with cattails and lily pads.

The short answer then is yes but be careful even nature has a way of mixing that actually has some order to it . It's not just chaos. Different Eco systems contain different plants and such for a reason. They each have a role to play in that system. The trick is to make each of the styles you use make sense and have a reason. Hope this makes sense

If you are a beginner then I would learn several styles first before trying to mix them.

Chris

 

[yakob]

Jacob,

It's a great question and my opinion is yes mix it any way you please. It's art express what you want. Just look around do you see only one kind of tree growing or one kind of flower and grass of course not. Nature is a mixture of flora and fauna. That's what makes it so interesting. As I look out my window I can count 8 different trees so many different grasses or weeds if you will along with cattails and lily pads.

The short answer then is yes but be careful even nature has a way of mixing that actually has some order to it . It's not just chaos. Different Eco systems contain different plants and such for a reason. They each have a role to play in that system. The trick is to make each of the styles you use make sense and have a reason. Hope this makes sense

If you are a beginner then I would learn several styles first before trying to mix them.

Chris

Mr. Chris,

Thanks a lot for your answer.

 

[diandwill]

A very classic method of mixing elements is Bulino images, with scroll surrounding it. This is seen on a lot of very high end guns. Fabbri of Italy has several styles on their website. Mr Coggin has shown us many absolutely amazing examples, and I know there are way too many posters here to start naming names. Suffice it to say that it is beautiful when done well.
As a jeweler I go out of my way to look at older jewelery engraving, on rings, pocket watches, hand mirrors etc. Most of the jewelry engraving is a basic scroll design simple shading with very strong bright cut elements, flowers, birds and the like. I find that combiation very nice...simple but elegant scrolls, nicely beveled with bright cut, almost westen style, flowers. I have to admit that I love Sam's engraved scroll rings, masterfully shaded, but they are still beyond me. Most of the jewelry engraving is designed to be a maximum appearance of embellishment, with a minimum of cutting. It is economics.

 

[John P. Anderson]

I like this discussion and have enjoyed everyones comments. I was confused with elements versus style. I'm ok with different elements. Trying to combine different styles is what I try and avoid. For example Art Deco doesn't really go with Victorian. Not that it can't be done. Hopefully I'm developing my own unique style of carving.

I'll leave with a picture of one of my favorite pieces of art that represents lots of different elements done in one style. Albrecht Durer, The Great Piece of Turf, 1503 from the web site: http://marinacarlson.wordpress.com/2012/03/01/picture-perfect/