graver question...

[Gemsetterchris]

Is it possible to get by without using a square graver?

I hate sharpening these things or at least the heels by hand.

I did a test and found that i can get far better results using a combo of onglette and flat shaped gravers.
Probably because i have used these daily for years.
Given the time i take to get a square graver ready i could have done the job twice using other "weapons".

Is it a big no no or a case of whatever so long as the final result is great??

 

[KCSteve]

Sounds like you are getting by without a square graver.

But I can tell you that it's easy to sharpen a square graver - as long as you have a little help. Either the GRS Dual-Angle fixture or the Lindsay Template based system will have your square gravers approaching perfection with little effort. The Lindsay system is easier to work - especially if you're trying to figure it out yourself - and the Dual Angle is more flexible (which is what can make it harder when you're starting out).

 

[FANCYGUN]

For years all I used were onglette and flat gravers. If it works for you then use it by all means. I never really liked sharpening the 90's also and totally hated the Crocker Sharpener I once tried to use. But with the sharpening jigs available now I have a wider range of tools that I have in my weapon arsenal like 90's, 70's and 105's.

 

[fegarex]

Like Marty and many others I also used onglettes for years. Once I got a modern sharpening fixture I use squares for the majority of my work. I find I can sharpen many of them at a time and make them ALL consistent. I could never do that with an onglette. It was always a crap shoot to make the next one cut like the last.
I think the fact the onglette could be sharpened quickly was the reason they became popular but since the innovations in sharpening fixtures the square has taken over.

 

[jimzim75]

Hi Chris,

Quote".
Given the time i take to get a square graver ready i could have done the job twice using other "weapons".

I would say, it's about time you got something to help you sharpen your graver in a fast and
repeatable manner. Both GRS and Lyndsay have good systems. I myself use a dual angle
head because I like to play with different geometries to get the best effect.

It takes roughly a quarter of the time, as aposed to doing it by eye. Every time I sharpen a square
for instance, I get same thing every time. This lets me concentrate of design, rather than
worry about what the gravers going to do.

I do a lot of setting work.

 

[Gemsetterchris]

I guess i could lose $89 for one of those template things.
Could i use different size gravers other than 3/32" ? i have a 1.75mm which is smaller.

If i can`t cut with that then i guess i best stick to other tools

 

[Sam]

You should definitely get a sharpening system. It will be money well spent. I've used the Dual Angle fixture for about 11 years now. I use it to sharpen common square gravers and I can radius heels on flats and make a variety of other shapes that are difficult or impossible to make (and/or accurately repeat) by hand.

 

[Arnaud Van Tilburgh]

I think the fact the onglette could be sharpened quickly was the reason they became popular but since the innovations in sharpening fixtures the square has taken over.

Rex, what makes the onglette different to the square, sharpen so easy?
As a setter goldsmith I used both the onglette and squares, I sharpened them with a carbone stone without a heel, just a very flat heel (2°) on the Arkansas stone.

The onglette never had a heel, the face was something about 65° or more.

arnaud

 

[fegarex]

Arnaud,
I was referring to sharpening them for engraving with a heel. The square is hard to put a heel on without a fixture. The onlglette is a matter of doing it quickly by hand. The problem is that making them the same each time is hard.

 

[Arnaud Van Tilburgh]

And I agree with Sam, I spend my last money some months ago to have the Powerhone, after I got that frustrated trying to build something in the meanwhile that could sharpen the face with the right angle, and put a short polished heel on it. :big grin:

At the moment I'm grinding a HSS 7 from a black square 90° for a parallel heel, it takes almost a whole day.
I just look at the graver from time to time to see if the long faces with 2° loft are like I want them to be.
The rest is for the power hone.

arnaud

 

[jimzim75]

Isn't an anglet A graver the is basically diamond shaped. If you took a blank piece of
stock, it could either be into a flat graver or turned to make a onglet or a 90°.
Isn't simple taking a 90° and sharpening it like a flat leaving the heal triangle shaped.

It seems like tool suppliers use the term onglet for any graver that isn't a round, flat,
or knife edge.

 

[Arnaud Van Tilburgh]

Okay thanks Rex, I understand.

arnaud

 

[Gemsetterchris]

Thanks for the advice.
I used the word onglette for the sake of the majority, we call it spitz stick in the UK.

So i just ordered a lindsay template system (cheaper option).

 

[FANCYGUN]

The onglette can best be described as a V tool with slightly rounded sides that come to a sharp point. These can be rather wide or narrow. I still favor the onglette for lines that will be inlayed. Old habit I suppose that eases the hang ups.

 

[Kevin P.]

Chris, The money for the dual angle sharpening jig is well spent. The dual angle allows you to use all three axis. Once you're accustomed to it everything is possible. The templates work well I'm sure; I have no experience with them. I just like the breadth of possibilities the dual angle allows. You can experiment with your own configurations.
Kevin P.