Diamantine

[bildio]

I purchased this Diamantine a long, long time ago when I was studying watchmaking. It must have been old stock at the time I purchased it as the label was worn & tattered as shown in the photos. I never opened the corked bottle, & the powder is still dry.

I assume it's a diamond polish, right? Would it be usefull for polishing gravers? Can someone translate the French(?) on the side of the bottle (lower photo)?

 

[dlilazteca]

Just use google translate search online

Carlos De La O III

 

[DKanger]

Polir l'acier is Polish for Steel and its grit is #1. It would be used first and then the final polish with #2.
Not unlike the various grades of emery or rottenstone.
It doesn't say what it is. Diamantine may be a brand name.

 

[Kevin Scott]

Diamantine has no diamond powder in it. It is a fine grade of aluminum oxide. Came in three grades, #1 which you have, and #2 and #3. #1 is the finest. Edit: #3 is the finest.

Watchmakers use it to make steel parts have a scratch free mirror finish. And usually perfectly flat. Some people think the parts are chromed since they are so bright and shiny, but they are not.

Was also used to polish gravers for use on a watchmakers lathe. But these gravers were only used to make make or repair watch jewel settings in gold or brass. These gravers would leave a brighter, flatter, scratch free finish on the jewel settings than could be achieved by polishing.

So it could be used to finish engraving gravers. In some of my old jewelry engraving books it might be mentioned. Don't remember.

It is a bit tricky to use properly. Takes practice. Basicly it is mixed with oil, often olive oil, into a very thick paste. Must spend a bit of time to thoroughly mix and crush the powder. Then used on ground glass to polish the steel. Sort of magical when done right. Suddenly the part turns like a mirror. Keep going and it makes scratches.

Translation: i don't know French, but Acier is steel. Neuchatel is a town in Switzerland. Depose is patent. J. Boillot is the maker or seller.

 

[Tim Wells]

It is used or was used to polish watch parts such as pivots by making a paste with watch oil and that powder. It would be a waste of time to try and polish a graver with it given the modern ways we all have available to us nowadays.

 

[Kevin Scott]

Polir l'acier is Polish for Steel and its grit is #1. It would be used first and then the final polish with #2.

Is this the translation from the side of the bottle? If so, then I am wrong about the three grades.

In practice, I don't really see any difference between the grades. Especially since you really have to crush the stuff up real well when mixing with the oil.

Edit: checked my bottles of diamantine. My bottle #3 I have labeled as the finest. Don't know what reference I used. when I labeled it. Still don't think there is much or any difference between the grades in actual usage.

 

[bildio]

Thanks everyone. Your replies answered my questions.

I did a Google search & see that Bergeon (Swiss) still sells Diamantine.

 

[Kevin Scott]

Here are jeweling gravers and tools made by a student of a very good and demanding watch repair school in the 1940's.

I am guessing he spent at least 12 hours on each one.
I don't understand why the square graver(top one in the first two pictures) that is similar to an engraving graver is not polished on the heels. The top is perfectly mirror finished. In the watch world, it is sometimes a "Black" finish.

I have never used these gravers. Have not practiced this type of work since there is not much call for it.

This school had the students make these gravers before they learned to use them. It was a lesson in filing, heat treatment, and metal finishing and polishing. And the use of diamantine. I am sure this student got an "A" grade. The pictures don't really the quality of the work and finish of the gravers and tools. The working parts have a mirror finish. And some of the tools have a mirror finish throughout.

In my Art Of Engraving book by Rees, written about 1900, he mentions using diamantine on a boxwood lap to polish the cutting edge of an engraving graver. Boxwood is commonly used by watchmakers for polishing parts etc because it is hard, has almost no grain, and oil free.

 

[bildio]

.
I don't understand why the square graver(top one in the first two pictures) that is similar to an engraving graver is not polished on the heels.

It was used with a jewelers lathe & set on a tool rest.

 

[Kevin Scott]

It was used with a jewelers lathe & set on a tool rest.

Yes, I understand that. I do quite a bit of watch lathe work. But like engraving, on the lathe the finish of the heels is what determines the finish of the work.

Maybe he never finished this graver? Or maybe this graver is used with the polished side down against the tool rest? I suspect he never finished this graver. On his other gravers all or most of the surfaces are mirror black polished, even the surfaces that do not affect the performance of the graver.

 

[bildio]

Yes, I understand that. I do quite a bit of watch lathe work. But like engraving, on the lathe the finish of the heels is what determines the finish of the work.

Maybe he never finished this graver? Or maybe this graver is used with the polished side down against the tool rest? I suspect he never finished this graver. On his other gravers all or most of the surfaces are mirror black polished, even the surfaces that do not affect the performance of the graver.

I watched W.R. Smith's superb "Graver Making & Hand Turning" video the other day. I think I recall, you are correct, it's used polished side down. He also shows gravers with polished heels.

I have Smith's tool rest too. It a "work of art", works very well, but expensive.