Finngerlish scroll

Gemsetterchris · Jun 14, 2010

Monday morning warm up session, took a rest from the paper & pencil to have a stab at this "finngerlish" type scroll.

I quite like them for a first try, plenty more practice to go...

Yes you are allowed to rip into them with your critical nitpicking :big grin:

Sam · Jun 14, 2010

Chris: The scrolls on the right which spiral off the large scroll on the left should be facing the opposite direction. Scrolls don't grow as you have done here. It's a common error made by those learning to draw scrollwork. / ~Sam

Gemsetterchris · Jun 14, 2010

Good call Sam, i knew messing with scrolls first thing monday morning was a bad idea

I`ll figure it out sooner or later.

Two Claws · Jun 14, 2010

Excuse me gentlemen: Revealing myself as a true newbie here.....just so I understand....the two scrolls on the right of the two-lobed C scroll should be 'flipped' over to the left side of the existing C scroll? And if so, is this because the larger lobe of the C scroll is on the left? Or am I just missing your point entirely, Sam? Thanks. (Chris....they looked great to me!

KSnyder · Jun 14, 2010

Two Claws, the scroll on the right is growing out of the (back) of the vine so to speak. Vines always progress forward and generally smaller.
Gemsetter, the cutting looks great to me. Just a minor adjustment.:big grin:

Gemsetterchris · Jun 14, 2010

If the big start scroll was reversed its ok i think?
I was spinning the paper so much trying to draw them i got lost on it :big grin:

KCSteve · Jun 14, 2010

Chris,

That would do it. Just think of the scrolls as actual, growing vines and it's easy to see - everything has to come from the origin and work it's way forward. Also helps you remember that things should be largest / most developed at the origin, not the 'new' growth at the end. Although it's usually out at the end where the flowers are...

Sam · Jun 14, 2010

Here you go.

Gemsetterchris · Jun 14, 2010

Many thanks Sam, that makes better sense now.

Finally i think i might be grasping the idea.

Peter_M · Jun 14, 2010

Nice cutting Chris, if Sam and others wouldn't have pointed out the oddity I sure wouldn't have noticed.

Then isn't the first leave in the c scroll going the wrong direction? Looks to me it is going the opposite way then the rest.

Peter

MICHAEL · Jun 14, 2010

Sam, A picture is worth a thousand words. Thanks for explaining, we all learned something!

Gemsetterchris · Jun 15, 2010

Finngerlish update

Peter_M said:
Nice cutting Chris, if Sam and others wouldn't have pointed out the oddity I sure wouldn't have noticed.

Then isn't the first leave in the c scroll going the wrong direction? Looks to me it is going the opposite way then the rest.

Peter

Yes Peter, that cut is wrong & i don`t think it should even be there.

Anyway i re-drew my practice as shown..
Not sure if it looks good with those small scrolls on the left, but just practice for learning how to add them correctly.

One other thing i found with drawing in the "leaves" was that i ended up with a smudged mess once shrunk down & transferred.. so i just shrink this as it is & cut the leaves ect by eye as i go trying to get them reasonably acceptable.

Just need to vecorise them & clean the curves abit first.
Depending how the small scrolls look once shrunk, i`ll see how to cut them or make them as "bits".

monk · Jun 15, 2010

not a joke, but i like gemsetters' design better. even tho sams' way may be "by the book". gemsetters' just looks better to me. btw, i'm not tryin to start a "scroll war" here, just statin a preference.

Gemsetterchris · Jun 15, 2010

monk said:
not a joke, but i like gemsetters' design better. even tho sams' way may be "by the book". gemsetters' just looks better to me. btw, i'm not tryin to start a "scroll war" here, just statin a preference.

Monk, i`m sure Sam was just pointing out how it should grow, not paying attention to if it looked good :big grin:

Gemsetterchris · Jun 15, 2010

I got thus far, not 100% but i think about as good as i can expect without more practice.
Will eyeball the filling in later.. must get a few hundred stones set this week so need to take a break.

Ok, had to finish off... i don`t like the two small left scrolls, otherwise it`s "sort of" getting somewhere i guess.
Let the wolves rip into it, then i can have more ammo for the next practice.

ETHELBERT · Jun 15, 2010

hmmm, learning something new all the time here....thanx

John B. · Jun 15, 2010

Chris,
The backbones you cut look pretty clean.
Some of the leaves look good, some not so hot. Early days.
you should see the mess I would make trying to set stones

I would advise keeping your scroll at least 8mm while you practice leaves.
Also, pay a little more attention to the center bud, please.
Take a look at some of Marcus's posts for this.
Keep going, you are well on your way.
Best.

Gemsetterchris · Jun 15, 2010

Many thanks John :tiphat:

I think i understand the centre bud problem & some others which is a start.

Next practices will be pencil & paper engraving as its alot quicker :big grin:

Then if i get an improvement i should in theory be able to re-produce in a 10mm size on the steel.

I`ll add stuff here to keep things all together.

Sam · Jun 15, 2010

The thing about scrollwork is that it has anatomy, just like wildlife, humans, or other things. While an engraving of a guitar looks cool, it MUST have 6 strings. I've seen engravers really blow it when engraving pictures of musical instruments because the instruments were not anatomically correct. Bird wings are not open to interpretation in realistic art. They have a specific amount of primary and secondary feathers that must be laid out correctly.

So getting back to scrollwork...there are rules which should be adhered to. While there are exceptions, the basic growth of scrolls should be adhered to for best results. There might be times when you can fudge those rules a bit, but adhering to them will give beginning designers a much greater chance for success.

Gemsetterchris · Jun 16, 2010

sam said:
The thing about scrollwork is that it has anatomy, just like wildlife, humans, or other things. While an engraving of a guitar looks cool, it MUST have 6 strings. I've seen engravers really blow it when engraving pictures of musical instruments because the instruments were not anatomically correct. Bird wings are not open to interpretation in realistic art. They have a specific amount of primary and secondary feathers that must be laid out correctly.

So getting back to scrollwork...there are rules which should be adhered to. While there are exceptions, the basic growth of scrolls should be adhered to for best results. There might be times when you can fudge those rules a bit, but adhering to them will give beginning designers a much greater chance for success.

I guess criminals can break the law easily but pay dearly & the lawyers who studied can bend the law & get paid dearly

Finngerlish scroll

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