Critique Request Is this the way a bulino scene has do be done

Arnaud Van Tilburgh · Oct 31, 2009

Bulino scenery is something that was on my learning list.
One has ordered two pendants displaying a howling wolf at full moon.

I even never tried to draw a wolf, so it was a bit hard to make the design right. While scratching for two days on this, I now see some mistakes on the Wolf design.

I also figured out that it is better to use a scratch pen to put the design on the plate, as on this one I engraved the outside lines, but that does not look good in my opinion.

While struggling with this kind of engraving, I wanted to give up several times, as I thought it was going totally wrong. But I learned that it is better to go all the way if one want to learn something.

I know it would be best to have a course, but that is something for later when I have some more basics on this.

I have added a blown up detail photo that shows what I have done, in life size it looks pretty good to me.

So here are my questions as I donâ€™t know much about bulino.
- For the wolf I used only lines, short ones and longer thicker ones, is that the way it has to be done?
- For the moon I used the graver with only hand pushing to ad some shading, are these dots too big?
- When you look at the blown up one, is the technique I used the right one, or is there something I must know?

Thanks for looking at it and giving me some feedback.

arnaud

jetta77 · Oct 31, 2009

looks pretty darn good arnaud. I'm sure someone w more bulino experience can give you better advise.

leroytwohawks · Oct 31, 2009

Looks good to me, and you say this is your first try.:thumbs up: I have read that in bulino both lines and dots are used. I think for a more photographic quality most of them use very fine dots, it kind of looks the same as if you where to put a black and white photo under your scope you would see the pixels of ink.

Ether way you are far ahead of me. Great job!:thumbs up:

Kevin

Andrew Biggs · Oct 31, 2009

Hi Arnaud

I would highly recommend Chris' Bulino DVD.

The thing that is most noticeable to me is the wolf looks a bit washed out with no shadow around the head area. Particularly in the mouth, nose and eyes.

They need to be a bit darker to give it more depth. For instance the inside of the nostrils on the nose. The inside of the mouth would be rounded so the shadow needs to go from black to a lighter grey to convey this sense of depth...........sort of like looking into a cave.........lighter in the entrance and darker further back.

The teeth are also a bit disconnected. They need to be attached to some gums and that is where the shadowing inside the mouth could give this type of effect.

The eyes need to look a bit more rounded as the eyeballs are more spherical in shape. At the moment they look a bit flat.

Cheers
Andrew

ddushane · Oct 31, 2009

Doesn't look bad Arnaud, You're gonna get there!

Dwayne

Arnaud Van Tilburgh · Oct 31, 2009

@ Andrew: Thanks for your support on this one andâ€¦

Yes will order Chris bulino DVD.
I already have one of his un-blackened castings like the one I ordered from the FEGA website.
However; in a previous tread we had a discussion about these casting plates, as I asked if one could get them without the paint.
I now have one from Chris, and that is excellent study material, not the inked ones.
And I suppose the casting from Chris that comes with the DVD is not blackened as well.

As far as I understand, you critiques are about contract, I knowâ€¦ I can ad another day to darken some areas. And probably I will. But first I wanted to know if the technique I use is correct. Sure Chris DVD will help on that, also all of the comments on this will.

About the teethâ€™s, yes they are not well placed, all of the autonomy of the wolf is not that good, I know. Butâ€¦â€¦ that was not the question. My question is about the technique, not the design. And I know, all starts with a good design.

About the eye, I know what you mean and there is an example how to do it right on the practice plate I have from Chris. Only the one eye of the wolf is less than Â½ mm. I have tried to add a iris around it, but that is like engraving an eye on a head pin.
And perhaps, when I engrave this for real, I make the design with the eye closed, as the wolf mostly howls with the eyes closed.

I also think, that the scenery, as it is night and seen by backlight, the wolf only needs contour. At least much more dark.
But for this practice I tried to show as much as I could.

@ Dwayne: thanks for the compliment

@ Kevin: thanks

@ Jeff: thanks and sure we learn from the masters

To be continued, arnaud

filbertius · Oct 31, 2009

Did you make your own source drawing, or did you end up finding one elsewhere? The entire scene is about 3 centimeters high? Nice job on the fur. I agree that a little more shading (especially in the mouth) will give it more depth.
Gary

Arnaud Van Tilburgh · Oct 31, 2009

Gary,

As there are no wolves in Belgium, I searched on the internet to have some idea hwo a wolf looks like. I have some dogs and sure that helps.

The â€œclichÃ©â€ about the howling wolf by full moon, that scenery I already knew and spoted into my head when the customer asked for two similar pendants of a wolf and moon.

So for this design I used two pictures I found on the internet ant made a new scene.

Here is my material I used to make this scene.

arnaud

Arnaud Van Tilburgh · Oct 31, 2009

Just to show you its size, the thumb probably already is

arnaud

Mario Sarto · Oct 31, 2009

Arnaud Van Tilburgh said:
...Only the one eye of the wolf is less than Â½ mm. I have tried to add a iris around it, but that is like engraving an eye on a head pin.

Arnaud - after watching the fantastic DVD from Mr. DeCamillis (you really have to see how he does) and a lot of practice you'll engrave twenty and more lines on a millimeter :thumbs up:

Kevin P. · Oct 31, 2009

Arnaud, you don't need advice except keep doing what you're doing and make sure you charge enough for it.
Man, this is art go your own way. People will chime in with suggestions and that's the way they might do it, but not necessarily how you should do it.

Not to abuse anyone but "you really have to see how he does) and a lot of practice you'll engrave twenty and more lines on a millimeter " Why? You've got talent; go for it.
I have to say further that Andrew is always to the point and his comments always improve the work.
I have the greatest respect for Andrew's eye; but who you making this for? My first look was that's great the customer will love it. If you do all that Andrew suggests, up the price or just remember what he says for your next piece. You have an eye for it Arnaud.
Congratulations!
Kevin P.

jerrywh · Nov 1, 2009

I see two major mistakes. #1 never cut a line for a outline on a animal with fur. always use the fur to make the outline as it is in reality. #2 the same goes for the lines around the mouth. The fur on the body is the way it should be done but I would say you quit too soon. It needs to have more. The inside of the mouth is not dark enough. Keep all the lines going in the direction of the fur. Cross hatching around the mouth betrays the look of a real animal.
My engraving instructor one told me " don't pay too much attention to your grandma's compliments." It will help you a lot to buy some castings from a real good bolino engraver like Lee Griffiths or Chris DeCamillas and study them under the scope. Marty Rabino is another one to study.
You have what it takes to get good fast.

dbrodhagen · Nov 1, 2009

Arnaud, great job for a first time bulino. I would think that instead of having a distinct outline, such as the edging on the fur (mainly on the head of the wolf, you would want to let the hair lines form the shape of the head, otherwise the wolfs hair seems to come our of the straight line that you have outlining the wolf's head. I hope that what I said makes sense, because by doing it that way it would aleviate the line that shows, giving it a more realistic quality. I am definately not an expert in engraving, but through years of carving the same effect is accomplished. Thanks, Dave

Arnaud Van Tilburgh · Nov 1, 2009

@ Jerry, thanks for your coments.
About the outlines, I know about that but it was to late as I started with these lines and although they where engraved very thin, they stay visible even after adding fur lines.

So next time I will lightly scratch these design lines.
Perhaps only when engraving a wale these outlines could make sense.

Also about the darkness in the mouth.
In general I think I can add some more lines to make some parts more dark, like Andrew suggested.

@ Dave, thanks for your suggestions, and yours are similar to what others already told.

@Kevin, Thanks for your compliment. My way learning things is “give it a try and see where struggling with it begins. Than try to find a solution for it. These solutions I find in books, probably on Chris DVD and by all of your comments in the cafÃ©.

Cutting 20 lines on a square mm is not that difficult using magnification, and I think I almost have cut that amount of lines. Certainly there will be 20 lines a mm when I would darken some areas on this practice plate.

But still I have an unanswered question about the dots on the moon. They look to big to me. Would it be better using some short lines to shade the moon?

arnaud

jerrywh · Nov 1, 2009

I think the engraving could be made to look a lot better by just sanding it down some and continue to shade it in. The dots on the moon are too big but the same thing would fix that also. I still have a lot to learn about bolino myself but from what I do know many of the best go thru the same problems of sanding and reshading stuff all the time. I have talked to or read articles by grand masters that indicate the same. I used to think that art was just a struggle for me but I think it is for every artist. We are not alone Arnauld.

Arnaud Van Tilburgh · Nov 1, 2009

Thanks Jerry, this helps a lot.

arnaud

Arnaud Van Tilburgh · Nov 7, 2009

One pendant finisched

Well, I finished one on of this scene on a Titanium plate.
Iâ€™m not sure if the customer is willing to pay for the time I have spend engraving it.
Therefore I have another scene that shows only the silhouette of the wolf.
For the background and moon I needed 4 ours.
I learned a lot about lines and dots, also thanks to Phil.

I could work some more ours on this one, but as it took me already12 ours, ( really cutting lines, not drinking coffee). So I have no problem to work things out the best I can, but after reading Andrewâ€™s â€œ A Method of Pricing Your Workâ€ .
And after all Iâ€™m a professional so I have to make a living. If I do another scenery for myself, I will spend all the time needed to have it perfect.

So therefore, I donâ€™t post a high resolution photo of this, just a bit bigger than real size.
In life size it looks a great scene with the wolf and moon, and Iâ€™m sure the client will love it, only the time spend on it could be a problem.
So I will make another one with less lines so I can sell it cheaper.

The eye teeth and nose I did on the practice plate, I did not do them on this one, as it is dark, and perhaps the wolf howls with his eyes closed, and if I would have tried it, for sure the customer has to buy a loupe just to see these details.

Anyway, I like it and I learned a lot of it, also I think I beginning to understand something about dots and short lines

arnaud

Phil Coggan · Nov 7, 2009

Arnaud,
Your second engraving on page 2 looks a lot better to me, you've taken the shading to a higher level.
When you copy something like this you need to keep looking back and forth from the copy to yours.
Bulino dots take a lot of time, that is if you want things to look really good, it's not production work ie. (and this is NOT a putdown of your work) but at a guess, I imagine that you could get five or more dots between the ones you have on the moon.
Flip your eyes between these two pictures and you will see what I mean about shading etc.

Phil

filbertius · Nov 7, 2009

Very nice finished plate. The mouth, nose and eye look good to me, and much more natural than the first drawing. I can't wait to see what you will produce when you are given more hours to spend on refining the image.
Gary

Arnaud Van Tilburgh · Nov 7, 2009

Phil, thanks for your feedback.
I know what you mean about flipping the eyes that helps to see tone and contrast.
Also I know about high and low resolution, and as you say I could ad 5 more dots between every dot, sure I can. Iâ€™m using a microscope and a very sharp Cmax graver.
And as this is one of my first tries, dots and line became smaller while cutting. So when I stopped there was already a big difference of size between the dot and line size where I started and ended.
I started with the background, than used the dots on the moon and dots on the head of the wolf.
After that as you see, I used short lines for the fur under the wolf head, and they are that fine, I canâ€™t even take a picture of it that shows it.
So that I also used a lot of small lines to adjust the head and lighter part on the left of the wolf head.
Next time I will try a bulino dot line engraving, I will start with shorter lines and smaller dots.
But as you say, it is not production work and will take lots of time to do it perfect.

It is like painting with a ONE hear brush. This was done already, I saw some of these painting

arnaud

Critique Request Is this the way a bulino scene has do be done

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