Question: Engraved Letters on a Remington 1875 Revolver (need help dateing engraveing

Dingus · Dec 6, 2015

Ok first post hope i can get some advise help. I have a Antique remington 1875 revolver made late 1870s . the gun has JOHN P CLUM 1882 engraved on the back strap and Toombstone AT on the barrels side. I was told by some engraveing expert (dont have the name handy) about 8 years ago that the engraveing was period correct to 1882.
Most of us know who John P clum was the mayor of toombstone when the earps were there they were all budys. anyway just like some thoughts on the engraveing. one fellow up here said its machine engraved and when i looked into that they had machines to help engrave in the late 1800s so that doesnt take away from the date it was done. it also could have been done later and the gun given to clum at some other place as a reminder of his time in Toombstone.
Ok theses pics are not the best but you can see the type of engraveing the guns patina runs thru the engraveing more so on the barrel. Let me know your thoughts on this engraveing please ?

DakotaDocMartin · Dec 6, 2015

It could be this one: http://forums.gunboards.com/archive/index.php/t-175807.html
Or this one: http://www.remingtonsociety.org/forums/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=4587

The fellow in the first forum link claims to have assembled it from parts.

Dingus · Dec 7, 2015

Yes that was me back when i found it years ago i dont need info on the gun im after info on engraveing thanks.
The gun came as a barrel and frame with the engraveing you see in the pictures i posted.
any ideas on old engaveing anyone ?

DakotaDocMartin · Dec 7, 2015

Dingus said:
Yes that was me back when i found it years ago i dont need info on the gun im after info on engraveing thanks.
The gun came as a barrel and frame with the engraveing you see in the pictures i posted.
any ideas on old engaveing anyone ?

When I look at the larger image (by clicking the posted image and choosing the magnifying glass button), the engraving looks to have been done by hand using a push graver.

diandwill · Dec 7, 2015

Any chance that the engraving was done earlier and applied to the frame and barrel later?

The condition of the piece shows that the engraving was present when the revolver ceased being cleaned and oiled. As said by Doc, it appears to have been hand pushed, but there is no way to determine when, within a 10-75 year period, the engraving was done. All that can be determined is that it was done by hand, and is in the same condition as the rest of the piece...at least in my opinion.

monk · Dec 7, 2015

the lettering on the backstrap doesn't seem as accurately done, as the work on the barrel. 2 different engravers ? maybe ? in any event it is hand cut. the inconsistencies and alignment would be somewhat reduced if this were by machine. just an opinion.

Dingus · Dec 7, 2015

DakotaDocMartin said:
When I look at the larger image (by clicking the posted image and choosing the magnifying glass button), the engraving looks to have been done by hand using a push graver.

Thanks so could that have been done in 1882 ? or there abouts ?

DakotaDocMartin · Dec 7, 2015

Dingus said:
Thanks so could that have been done in 1882 ? or there abouts ?

It could have been done just about anytime. There's no way of dating it. If you watch Pawn Stars, you'll know that without documented provenance... you don't really have anything.

Dingus · Dec 7, 2015

DakotaDocMartin said:
It could have been done just about anytime. There's no way of dating it. If you watch Pawn Stars, you'll know that without documented provenance... you don't really have anything.

Yes well thats why im checking up on it. its old engraveing because the patina on the barrel runs thru the cuts.
I just dont want to refinish it if there any chance its really clums gun. Be alot easyer for me if it was a fake as the gun has a decent bore will make a great shooter. But i cant touch it yet. i was hopeing the type or style of engraveing would help.

atexascowboy2011 · Dec 7, 2015

Dingus,
You're close enough to the Cody museum to swing by or send them a picture.
You might be surprised as to what they or the NRA museum would offer.

Sam · Dec 7, 2015

Examination under a microscope can reveal if it's done by hammer & chisel or pneumatic handpiece.

Dingus · Dec 8, 2015

Thanks guys all great advise, im in Canada tho not Texas the guy who bought it was in CA from the past away collectors wife who was in texas.
But i am gona get it checked out. I just think because of how it was found just the barrel and frame tucked away in a big texas collectors collection that he hung onto till he Died (his wife sold it thinking it was worth not much at all) She could be right but why did he keep it. and if someone was doing it as a fake why wouldnt the rest of the gun be there. most fakes try to make the item look good so people will buy it not like something that was found in the desert burryed in the sand.
Hey i could be wrong sure , but i just want to find out. other wise its gona be im my collection till i die and my wife sells it LOL

Roger Bleile · Dec 8, 2015

I have responded to this inquiry by e-mail.

Question: Engraved Letters on a Remington 1875 Revolver (need help dateing engraveing

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