Question: Silver Ring Engraving

dlilazteca · Jun 26, 2015

Oh Brian, you seem to be all in a knot again, no one is saying that one method is better than another you comment of "place your bets" is just wrong in my opinion. It seems like you feel people challenge you when they have input in any form. Relax no need to make it a challenge, dont make this another thread like those please. My two cents worth and I leave this thread to you guys that have valuable input and suggestions. Good day to all.

Saludos,
Carlos

Brian Marshall · Jun 26, 2015

Carlos, my goal in taking the time to refute the 2 posts was and is simple. Don't make statements not based on real world possibilities.

How in the hell is making statements on a thread - that cannot be backed up - considered "valuable information"? To whom?

Go get yourself an electro-etch setup like your knifemaker friend. (you don't already have one?)

Try getting the results shown in the images at the beginning of the post with that setup.

ON SILVER. I already know it cannot be done on this particular planet, because I tried it years ago. You have yet to learn.

If you really want a forum filled with inaccurate information (or want to fill it with your own)... have a little patience - I will be gone again, as soon as I finish this *%#$ job.

B.

I have never said that those characters absolutely cannot be etched into silver. I did say you will not get the results in the images.

I also said - that I could not get those results with a knife etching kit. Perhaps you can? Get one, TRY IT - and you'll be qualified to say something definite.

Right now, you are not. You are guessing that what you saw worked for steel would work for silver - and you did that without allowing for the appearance of taper, angle and depth in SILVER...

Meanwhile, try not to be misleading the newbies...

Dad of 3 · Jun 26, 2015

I normally would never disrespect another persons work but here goes. This ring was etched and darkened poorly, however the look seems popular for whatever reason. This poster is looking for a way to produce these rings. I told him a way to produce the ring, or if it makes you feel better a ring very close to what we can see from this internet picture. I almost positive this very picture was on an etching forum within the last few months. Here is what it looks like to me. It looks like blue pnp that didn't take well.
Here is a thought Brian, if you spent half the time you spend talking down to folks on here, providing how to videos instead you will start being thought of as the expert you think you are.

Brian Marshall · Jun 26, 2015

I am willing to engrave as close a wobbly copy as I can on scrap and post it here, for comparison to the original. (ie counterfeit it)

Are you willing to do the same on a piece of silver with what you know of etching?

That's as simple as it gets... and as much time as I am willing to waste on this.

B.

Dad of 3 · Jun 26, 2015

I'll do one better than that. I'm going to find the original maker and bring them here to tell all. If I can't find that pic again(which I doubt) I will etch an example in silver. The fact you think I'm going to use an elctro etch shows your knowledge loud and clear already...

Dad of 3 · Jun 26, 2015

I have some feelers out to try and find the maker. I will say my intention was to try and help this guy get moving on these rings. Either way anything further from me is simply trying to provide an option for the original poster.

Brian Marshall · Jun 26, 2015

I would hope you won't try use a knifemakers electro-etch on silver! Total waste of time.

That was Carlos's suggestion, what he saw, how he interpreted what he saw and then jumped in with it - not having had any personal, hands on experience using that method on silver.

Apparently you don't know what he was referring to? Those setups are for etching an engravers mark or signature on steel. google em.

Please re-read carefully what I have said. If you do, you may note that I mention mordants early on...

From what you just wrote, I'm wondering if you understood what I have said from the get go.

You stated that what was shown in the image was etched. I said I disagreed.

Hope you find the legit maker and we'll know for sure.

Then you can go get the plate out of the refrigerator and I will consume it, as I said.

B.

DanM · Jun 26, 2015

Dad of 3

How many hundreds of gold or silver rings have you made? Have you actually ever hand engraved anything?

Silberschweif · Jun 26, 2015

hey guys calm down

@ dad of 3 if you use pnp blue how do you bring the heat to the picture ? are u using an electric iron ? i canÂ´t imagine that it works on a ring

I hope youÂ´ll find the original maker or show us how to do it.

@ brian breathe and smile

atexascowboy2011 · Jun 26, 2015

Brain,
it's good to have you back ! :happyvise:

Things were getting pretty boring without you around to stir the pot.

Brian Marshall · Jun 26, 2015

Jephro!

Someone broke yer arm? Or you jus' gettin' too old to find the pot and stir it yerself?

B.

oiseau metal arts · Jun 26, 2015

the metal can talk! listen to it.
it has no ears though, and cant hear us argue over what who thinks can do what to make it look like this one. bottom line is the marks on the ring SAY what WAS done to that one. I have my guesses, and only removing the black paint/ink to see the inside of the cuts will prove if what Im guessing actually happened. im leaning more toward it having been carved in wax and then cast. the lines are not uniform in depth and show the wrong textures to have been etched. also the cuts are not clean enough to have been engraved in the metal (unless it was engraved in a master then mold and waxes made) also there seems to have a slight contouring of each grid section. this is usually caused by the finishing methods used to clean up after casting and give that coarse satin finish.

the original poster was looking for info on how to make some, but not fully knowing where to start. looks like he has received much good advice and suggestions on several ways to do something similar, or just like it. if nothing else he should at least have learned just how many different approaches there are to potentially doing 1 design.

Dad of 3 · Jun 26, 2015

https://www.facebook.com/Tesbihmarket

Here it is. He cam onto a etching forum I look at from time to time a few months back. December 9 2014 is a pic of this same ring. I've taken the bait for the last time Brian. I have wasted time I can't get back during our busy season. I should have said it could be etched but you jumped on one single word just to cause a problem. If anyone every wonders why the engraving commmunity is so small look no further than bs like this. Here is a new guy to the forum and this is what he gets??? I'm done! You can talk to whomever has nothing better to do but listen to you...

Brian Marshall · Jun 26, 2015

One word... can destroy a civilization, a city, an organization, a person or a life... kinda like the proverbial horseshoe nail.

Being more precise is likely to make life easier on yourself as well as everyone around you.

Now that I've looked - it seems you've "quit" forums before - including this one, over similar flat declarations.

Just quit - instead of "Just Do it" - or just admitting you didn't really know much about what you were writing... when someone (like me) calls you on it.

It is also a slick way to avoid coming up with proof of something you declared was the "way" it was done.

B.

Brian Marshall · Jun 26, 2015

Quote Originally Posted by Dad of 3 http://www.engraverscafe.com/showthread.php?p=179109#post179109
That ring you posted was etched. Very cheap and easy to do. The ring is a very common blank sold by a ton of vendors. Buy the blanks and have 10 of those type of rings done by lunch.

I agree with the etching Ive seen my local knife maker etch his detailed makers mark on 10 knives in no time flat, and to the looks of that design its not complicated at all.

Saludos,
Carlos

Taken out of context from other threads... but related to what has been written in the past coupla pages of this thread:

<"There are those who reply to basic questions with "RTFM" types of responses, which are ... well, discouraging.

The search for the 'right' way to do things, especially when starting, is daunting and truly fraught with some very bad suggestions. Just a little bit of correct guidance from those who have gone through it can have two long lasting consequences -
Starting a new engraver down the right path so that they have a chance to grow.

Providing encouragement so that that in addition to the engraving they are bolstered by joining a group of pleasant, helpful and like minded craftsmen who care deeply about the craft.

Personally, I think it boils down to a choice as to how one would like to be remembered - as an unhelpful curmudgeon, or as a mentor.

Just my two cents. I have to say that I've received quite a bit of help here, and like to think I've put it to good use.">

Bob A.

<"My main point is two fold: 1) its not a new trend and it wont stop with us complaining; and 2) if it bothers you, don't encourage it with an answer. If other people want to step in and help, let them. Some newbies offer some pretty humorous instructions.">

BeathardEngraving.com

DanM · Jun 26, 2015

The Facebook page is Turkish but the photos show a number of different techniques. The blurry photo of the polished Abjad Hawaz ring appears to have the numbers/letters engraved with the sides of the cuts at a 65-75 degree angle from the bottom point.

dlilazteca · Jun 27, 2015

Dad of 3 said:
https://www.facebook.com/Tesbihmarket

Here it is. He cam onto a etching forum I look at from time to time a few months back. December 9 2014 is a pic of this same ring. I've taken the bait for the last time Brian. I have wasted time I can't get back during our busy season. I should have said it could be etched but you jumped on one single word just to cause a problem. If anyone every wonders why the engraving commmunity is so small look no further than bs like this. Here is a new guy to the forum and this is what he gets??? I'm done! You can talk to whomever has nothing better to do but listen to you...

So your saying there is more than one way to accomplish a mission...wow and here I was thinking the Brian was the know all be all of the engraving world, because be sure says it like its his way is the solution to world hunger and eveything in between.

LIKE I SAID, NO ONE IS SAYING THAT ONE IS BETTER THAN THE OTHER

AGAIN I SAID NO ONE IS SAYING THAT ONE IS BETTER THAN THE OTHER

but it was said clearly in the above post there are several ways to get the job done, and nothing more, like they told you "relax and breath" count to 10 and everything in betwwen. no ones out to get you.
You talk like you have a vast knowledge, and there are those that can attest to it, and thats great no one can take that from you, but your not the the only guru around let others share thier knowledge and diffrent ways of doing things, no need to get upset and defensive.

Saludos,
Carlos

Brian Marshall · Jun 27, 2015

Ummm Carlos....

Do you actually think that this might "upset" me?

Most of my day has been spent laughing at what I am seeing in this thread! You are a teacher and you can't see why it's funnier'n hell?

Of course you can etch letters and numbers onto rings! But you are NOT going to get the same result shown in the image. THAT was his number one requisite.

You could actually get the job done with stamps - which is why I offered to show him. But it would be a miserable way to go and would not be my personal choice. I'm always willing show someone what they think will work. It's the best way I have ever found for them to find out that a job needs to be thought through.

He never asked what my choice would have been did he? Or you? Or D of 3?

And... you are not gonna etch much of anything into silver with a knifemakers electro-etch makers marking kit, just because you saw one work on steel. Test me. See if I'm full of BS. Go get one and try it.

I know both of those those things to be true for myself, 'cause I been there and tried doin' that.

It's your turn now. Maybe ya'all are or can be better at doin' that stuff? Show me. Show us.

How's that drawing practice coming?

B.

By the way, I have given some thought to solving a part of the world hunger problem. If everyone on the planet were to grow two zucchini plants... well, you'd know it would work if you've ever done it...

dlilazteca · Jun 27, 2015

Relax, enjoy the day today.

Saludos,
Carlos

Eugene Carkoski · Jun 27, 2015

Do you think that the letters could have been engraved, and not very good I might add, then dunked in an acid to get the aged affect?

Question: Silver Ring Engraving

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