Question on price quote

I received an inquiry last night on engraving English Scroll on a Remington 870, full coverage. I explained I couldn't provide a "blind" quote without first understanding his requirements and expectations, but he insisted, so I threw a quote of $4000 out there. He got kind of snippy and wondered if that included the entire barrel! Just wondering; was I out of line, and how would you have handled the situation?

Thanks in advance for your comments and suggestions.
Bill

Far from it for me to be the 'expert' here, as quotes have always been my weak point. Some guys quote by the square inch, depending upon what type of engraving. English scroll, bulino, or just 'plain Jane' are all going to be different. The customer had an obligation to be more specific with you, and perhaps he/she should've included a photocopy of something they liked, but not necessarily would want an exact copy of. This would've helped. Also, certain areas of the country seem to get higher or lower prices. . .has to do with the economy, and some people are just plain 'cheap'. Others who've dealt more with this issue should chime in. The 'per square inch' thing would work, in some cases, with a sketch fee, if involved. I'd be interested, myself, to see what others think on this issue.

The customer is always right, but that doesn't mean he or she will be my customer. I don't do engraving, but carving is the same thing, until I actually know what they want, I try not to give a quote, if forced to I go on the real high side. If they get snotty, I tell them where to go, it's a one way trip.

Bill,For starters I want know from the customer what is your budget,scroll design,coverage,game scenes drawings and to find out if they are really serious ask for a deposit for the art work witch will go towards the cost of the engraving,that's when you'll know if you got the work.I'm always asked about cost and I tell the interested person it depends on the coverage and time to prep the gun for engraving. J.J.

No, you weren’t out of line. The person making the enquiry was….no decent tradesman would even dream of giving a price without seeing the job and understanding the clients expectations. He was just being ignorant so drop him like a can of worms and move on.

There are basically two types of customers. Those in the trade that are aware of the process and the costs involved. Then there is the private customer that is looking for something but usually has no idea of the process or costs.

The first group is generally easier to deal with. The second group require education as they normally don’t have a clue and need a bit of hand holding.

For general enquiries I give an estimate of the price ranges……….from X amount to X amount depending on coverage, design and things like background removal etc etc. This sorts the wheat from the chaff.

This either makes their eyes water a bit and they never come back………..or they want to go the next step. The next step being a photo and a few rough dimensions along with a budget and what can or can’t be done within that budget.

And on the process goes until drawings are done along with deposits etc etc…………education is the key to those that have the budget and inclination.

It’s fair to say that most private enquiries go nowhere because the customers expectations of work/money are totally unrealistic. Which is fair because you don’t know till you ask but we are not the mall guys with a rotary tool. By giving an initial price range in a quick return e-mail it gets sorted very fast.

But there are some things I never do. I don’t haggle, I don’t tolerate rudeness and I never entertain cheap…….cheap attracts cheap and it tells your potential clients that your time is less valuable than theirs.

Unfortunately gun owners are amongst the worst out there. They generally want to bore you to death for an hour or more with their shooting exploits, hunting stories, hot loads and gun modifications. None of which I’m interested in. Then they balk at the price because the gun is only worth $200, which is not my problem. Then they always seem to think that someone else will do it for a fraction of the price you are asking. Sadly that is almost always true. Or they seem to think we are some kind of brotherhood of arms that love nothing better than working for nothing on their grandfathers “heirloom” In other words they have long pockets and short arms. The very worst to deal with are the ones with a really badly engraved gun that was done dirt cheap and they want to know if you can recreate their masterpiece. This type generally get insulted when you tell them that you can’t work that badly no matter how hard you tried

Having said that……..In amongst all of that there are some real gems to be found. People that are realistic, good to deal with and genuinely interested in and want what we do. They are the customers we want. It just takes a while to sort them out……………so be upfront about the money and that generally sorts them out very quickly.


Cheers
Andrew

nothing wrong with a clear-cut idea of what a client wants. better to mildly irritate up front. saves an absolute meltdown later. if you "lose" this guy, at least a mistake has not happened.

If they force you to give a quote tell them an hourly rate. When they ask how long, tell the you need more information on the design. If they still want a price either walk away or give them a range ($500-$5000 with no inlay or bulino work) if they come back upset tell them that you cant give a price without a design. Then run away. Dont work for people tgat are bossy up front they are worse in the back....

Just say your hourly rate but you have no idea how long it'll take yet.

If a customer gets snippy they never hear back from me. Simple as that. Many (most?) people have NO idea how much time is involved in gun engraving.

Thanks for the replies. The conversation started off on the wrong foot to begin with. I didn't remember his name or the previous conversation, as he said he had contacted me last February, but I never got a follow up from him then, so I just plain had forgotten. After being reminded, I remembered , but, if my memory serves me right, that conversation wasn't pleasant either. Kind of bossy. Then I remembered he is in Fayetteville, a town loaded with military and he is military. Career military personnel have an attitude all their own, hence the curt responses. When I could not get him to understand that it would be impossible to give a quote without more information (coverage, style, budget etc.) he still pressed for a "general" quote, at which time I gave him the $4000 figure, hoping to drive him off. Don't want to get him too mad, as he got my name from the FEGA site and I want to protect the brotherhood and not go off on him. Believe it or not, he still wants a quote and a time frame to start and estimate of completion date.

I appreciate all the replies and suggestions offered, which reinforced my thoughts, but it is always good to get the opinions of your peers. Some folks are just hard to deal with, but I think I'll try and educate this gentleman and send a formal inquiry on my letterhead describing my terms and requirements from him, along with a price list of services offered. I do that with all my commissions any way, but this time he caught me off guard.

No need to drag this out, but I'll let you know the outcome.

Bill

P.S. I'm USMC, if he's Green Beret we may have an issue! Just kidding!

dealing with "chuckle heads" is the worst I deal with friends of friends and inlaws and the such all the time. Not for engraving but for leather work, both for gun leather custom one off rigs and CC rigs, also custom one off MC seats its all the same....MONEY talks BS walks bottom line non refundable down payments have to be made and are part of the full price. My time conceptualizing and coming up with a few thumbs of the product... the customer gets what they pay for, what ever their budget is but either they love it or I keep it...the time I spend on the art is paid for up front by the down payment...if there is no art (like on a CC rig) they get a up front quote and pay for it once its done. if they don't like the rig I keep it...I haven't kept one yet....yet...im sure someone will back out someday...good luck with the chuckle head!

When the comment 'does that include the entire barrel' popped up that would be when I would say...'no, that requires another 6 grand'.

Boy I've missed a lot over the holidays. A jeweler never sleeps this time of year nor does he get to hang out on the forum. I can appreciate your experience here. Andrew was spot on with his comments. When I first started engraving to any serious degree, I got excited with every inquiry I got. It took me a while to realize that only one out of every hundred was prepared or already aware of what hand engraving really entails. Most have no clue what they are getting into and as was mentioned before, a quick email with some basic information and price ranges usually sorts them out.
The next problem is that many people are serious about having work done but don't own a firearm suited to engraving. If I took on all the jobs where the customer just wants " just a name and a date" put on a new shotgun, I'd be doing a lot of business. Don't even mention the glocks, AR15s and all the other guns with oddball finishes.
The reality of it is that very few guns are really suitable for engraving and even fewer gun owners prepared for the commitment. It is a joyous occasion when someone walks in with a budget in mind and a blank canvas that can be chucked up in the vise readily. Sadly those jobs are few and far between.
I'm glad I don't rely on engraving as my sole income. I can afford to be very choosy in the projects I want to take on. I've found that if something doesn't feel right about the customer or the project, then run. I can only go downhill from there.
Layne Z.

Andrew has given a ton of great advice.
Here's my two cents worth:
There are two types of people we are dealing with: Customers and shoppers.( I don't have to explain the difference, so I won't bore you with that diatribe)
When asked for a quote, I usually ask them to first consider a budget and proceed to tell them what $500.00/$1500.00/$2500.00,etc.,etc. can get them.
I also consider it a service to inform them that when I'm done engraving $2500.00 on a $500.00 Remington 870, they still have a $500.00 gun.
Most folks asking for quotes are newbies. They have a few extra bucks in their pocket, want something very personalized and have absolutely NO CLUE about engraving. Be kind and gentile, even if they are rude or snippy.(They might not hear back from me, but I won't be rude)
I think it's totally ok to tell them your price and explain it---and don't change your mind. There's plenty of work to keep you busy and there's no point in working,working,working for next to no profit just for the sake of keeping busy. (There has to be enough work around the house that will keep you busy and pay about the same as your cheap engraving prices)
You'll never get burned on a job you don't do.
I have my favorite charities, but my customer isn't one of them.

"I have my favorite charities, but my customer isn't one of them."

Very well put Brian!!

And I like:

"You'll never get burned on a job you don't do"


B.