Christmas in October

dlilazteca

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My birthday is on the 28th who knows better what I need but me.

Still on book one a wealth of knowledge.


sanding stones in three grits


My new draw plate



15 inches 24kt gold



Easy graver 105, should make my sharpening life easier.



wow, im on page 36 and I love what im reading, I don't recommend this one for beginners but after you've mastered the basics this is a must have.



3/32 square tubing so I can make some small gravers from 1/16 carbide stock I have.



small 1.8 collets to go along with the 105 easy graver



to change my old grs power hone to the new quick change disk type.



The reality as you learn there is always something to buy, not because you have to but your skill set expands you strive to do more challenging work, at least for me I justnwant to get better and better.

remember I bought it all on sale, well at least the boxes she did get to see. lots of reading ahead and practicing. SO exciting!

Saludos,

Carlos
 
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Brian Marshall

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Hmmm, and those things might be?


Rolling mill, ingot molds, crucibles, tongs, 3 complete sets of torches/fuels/gauges, heat treating kiln, lathe, mill, surface grinder, shears, casting equipment, and, and, and...


Or somethin' simple and relatively inexpensive? Like a coupla good pencils and a pad of high quality drawing paper?


B.
 

dlilazteca

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already have my black book for drawing at my side now, was just looking at some old (early 2013) drawings or an attempt...boy are they ugly

Have come a long way and now...

Have to put some of Rons teachings to practice.


Knife im working on now



Saludos,

Carlos
 
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Brian Marshall

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Maybe it's just me... or maybe it's a generational thing?

But it seems like, once upon a time, people would slowly begin to acquire one skill and take some serious time mastering it while also slowly collecting the tools needed for that particular skill... repeating that process over and over and over as they "climbed the ladder" and built a collection of skills.

Nowadays, it seems like it's the reverse? Snatch up all the tools you "think" you may ever need as quickly as possible, and then try to learn ALL the skills at the same time? (often in the wrong order and losing track of where you are on the ladder - or even which way is up)


Yeah, I'm gettin' old, but this sure seems to me like a recipe for disaster... especially if you completely detour around the basics, putting them off because they aren't exciting or glitzy and don't show instant results.

There is a time tested reason for "paying your dues"... and you can't pay those dues with cash, checks or credit cards. You pay with blood, sweat, tears and thousands of hours.

You cannot just use Paypal, buy a Lindsay or a GMax and become an overnight sensational replica of Sam Alfano or Steve Lindsay. It won't happen. (but the tool vendors will gladly take your money and let you try it - and laugh all the way to the bank)

All of those on the forum whose work is admired and held in high esteem earned their place. And the tools they used did not put them there... the skills did.

Nor did they get there in a coupla years.

Slow down. What's the big hurry?


Brian


Assuming they still teach kids to write at all(?) - imagine a child learning to recognize, form and write/draw his very first numbers... and the next morning the teacher hands him/her a test on calculus. What do you think the result will be?

My guess... one very frustrated child.


TANSTAAFL
 
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dlilazteca

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Hundreds sure thousands getting there, but unless I have an unknown relative thats an engraver and will inherit, ill need books to learn, tools to make my engraving easier especially those hard to reach places, gold because ive inlayed plenty of practice pieces time to try something for real, books at a great price on which I get inspiration and pushes me to work harder, so a recipe for disaster not on my end, I draw as much as I can you should see my training manuals, oh dam I was training (we never had this conversation) disaster maybe for some but not for me. Unless your going to buy me my tools?

I think I spend every free moment at the bench, I have to be threatened and hot water poured on me to get me away. I also think the newer generation has the ability to learn at a faster speed, through practice, internet forum for example, emails, videos, dvd, awsome books, new tools that makes it easier (pneumatic handpiece).

I can't speak for everyone but im in this for the long haul. I will succeed no room for failure.

Some have said dont engrave a gun to early, you know what they were right, but I did anyways some time back, boy did I mess it up, hahah but im ok with it, its my money, no harm no foul, its my gun, but ill be honest it was one of the best if not the best learning experiences ive had when it comes to engraving.

Not everyone learns at the same pace, and some just fade into the sunset. Im the exception to that rule, im here to stay. One day, one day at a time, but one day closer to my goals. Do as I say not as I do. Listen to the advice given these guys and gals know best. Brian is a wealth of knowledge. But I just like to p iss into the wind, why beacause I can.

Love ya guys

Saludos,

Carlos
 

bildio

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Carlos, Happy Birthday!

A piece of advice. Don't take those books to work ;)
 

Brian Marshall

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Carlos,


You are who you wanna be.. neither I nor anyone else is gonna change that.

We're all different and everyone has their own favorite learning process. If it's the way that works best for you - do it.

Don't pay any attention to old men...


But maybe, just maybe, taking one step at time would also give you what you are looking for?

Have you ever tried it? Given it fair chance?

You might actually like the results...


B.
 
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dlilazteca

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Brian, amigo I do take it one step at a time, every word you recommend is read in detail, my practice plates are guns thats all, im a little wierd. all my tools are start up tools if you think about it. Dont get frustrated with me, gonna need the stuff today or tommorow but will need it non the less. My only issue is that I have to buy ten sets of everything if I want to catch up to you.


Even what you say now has me thinking on my next design drawing, it pushes me harder to succeed, thank you for all the advice, really thank you.

Saludos,

Carlos
 
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dlilazteca

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Carlos, Happy Birthday!

A piece of advice. Don't take those books to work ;)


Thank you

I recovered that book, was found in a service room ( air conditioning units) room. SO glad I found it, never going back to work.

Saludos,

Carlos
 

bildio

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Thank you

I recovered that book, was found in a service room ( air conditioning units) room. SO glad I found it, never going back to work.

Saludos,
Carlos

That's good news. I was wondering what happened, i.e., did you buy another copy or find the one you owned.
 

Brian Marshall

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One set of "everything" will do... but that's only if you intend to do ALL the things necessary to make the piece you engrave.

Otherwise a simple set of engraving tools will do.

I am a metalsmith/stone setter who also engraves. Not the other way around.


I have multiples of "everything" simply because it's easier than sharing mine out amongst 6+ people at once. (and then trying to pick my personal favorites outta the piles afterwards)

Unless you have plans to do something like that, one set should suffice.


I would bet that Phil Coggan and Weldon don't need/use half what you think is necessary - and I don't think anyone on this forum can argue with their results.

Have you tried either technique (hand push or hammer & chisel) to the point at which you felt really comfortable with it?


Think you're never gonna use hand push? Go look at the Lindsay lettering videos. See that lil' flat graver that he finishes the cuts with? That's not in a handpiece...

There's a youtube video where the engraver is finishing off the eye of a cat I believe. You can see it's not done with a handpiece.

There's two or 3 guys on here from Spain & Argentina who do amazing monogram & lettering work - by hand pushing the graver.

Every one of these guys makes a living at it. AND DOES IT FASTER AND MORE ACCURATELY than you can currently do it with your $1,000+ tools.


I'm not saying that you need to make your living that way. I am saying it surely couldn't hurt to get that technique down before you move on to the thousand dollar class of tools.

It will cut your learning curve way down, because doin' it the "old way" teaches you things you'll never "get" any other way.


Like for instance - how it feels to stick a graver clear through the web between thumb and forefinger... and see it wigglin' on the other side.

Or slide one under the tendons on the back of your off hand...


Brian
 
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Haraga.com

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Brian that's crazy talk. No human being should be made to engrave by hand. It's just too hard. It's just too much work. It takes too long. It's easier to borrow a few grand and use a machine.
 

dlilazteca

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One set of "everything" will do... but that's only if you intend to do ALL the things necessary to make the piece you engrave.

Otherwise a simple set of engraving tools will do.


Brian,

That's all I have one, remember im working with firearms, im sure your familiar with the tools needed to engrave guns, all I really need is a nail and a rock if it really came down to it, and years of learning. But times and technology moves on , why use an optivisor when I can use a scope, why use a bench vise when I can use my magna block, why chase my work when I can buy a turntable, yes it can be done Weldon is a prime example of hammer and chisel (beautiful work by the way). The ONLY tools I buy are for making my life easier for when I engrave what I love firearms. There is nothing I have bought that does not serve that purpose. I've read for hundreds of hours practiced for just as much, never read anything that stated that I should make my life harder and not buy the right tools for the job, or that i should buy one a year.

I feel a great majority of the people that start this awsome art give up to soon because they dont want to buy the right tools for the job (and dedication)and make thier lives harder than it should be, not that engraving is easy, I know its anything but that.

But just like in the military you need the right tool for the job, or your chances of failure increase. Soldiering 101


oh did try my hand at hand pushing, did on ok job for my first go really no bs. Have I done it since no, I was just presented with an opportunity to get the gist of it, and I could not let it slide out of my hands, I know there is other places I need to perfect before I can move to that, but when the time comes I'll know what to expect. I'll find the picture for ya.

my first honest to GOD try I ever had, no oils or paint added. not bad for a first time hand push.




Brian im not buying a laser welder........but if your selling one cheap....hahahaha just messing with ya. Thanks for everything really believe me your input, emails, phone calls and all the questions you've answered are greatly appreciated, this forum would not work without people like yourself. How I decide to handle the information given is another story, there's more than one way to skin a cat. (sorry cat lovers) perfect example gold inlay... Which technique is the correct technique if they all accomplish the same thing?





Saludos,

Carlos
 
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