Christmas in October

I am envious of those with sketchbooks full of fully realized drawings. I have wanted to do that for 40 years. I have the empty books. I have the pencils, but it doesn't happen. I do draw of course, but usually to the point where I can picture the work in my mind's eye, and then I start the work and it tells me where to go, along with drawing on the work itself. Most of my work is more 3D than 2D and I view it in soft light in soft-focus to see what presents itself. I find that when it is right, I get an actual feeling between my eyes and my gut.

So, drawing for me is essential, but is more part of the process than a way of honing my design. I complain to myself that I would be "better". if I worked at it more, but the longer I live the less convinced I am of that. Part of the beauty of being human is accepting our own unique differences and those of others.

Tool junkie? You bet. My garret is chock-a-block. But, in practice there are a handful or less of tools I use 90% of the time. Didn't see anything in Carlos' stocking that looked extravagant or unnecessary.

I think the main thing is to find a way that works for you that will entice you to return to the bench. Spending lots of time at it is the only way to make progress.

Keep up the good work!

You know Brian, I hate to disagree with you (in part because when I do I'm usually wrong) but I'm still sticking with my take on modern tools.
You (heck, even me by this point) can teach pretty much anyone to cut a line with hand push, hammer & chisel, or air-assist in a few minutes. Probably take as long to teach them how to hold the tools as to use them.

But it's what happens after that first little bit where I (and I think Carlos) see a difference: with air-assist we move on from working on just cutting a line to cutting a design. I definitely agree with you that knowing how to make good use of the 'older' methods is an assist when using air-assist. While I don't really have hand push gravers (I do have a few of the GRS handles for QC gravers so by one way of looking at it I've got lots of hand push gravers). But usually what I do is just not step on the pedal, or perhaps add just a hint of power on some strokes.

As to drawing (which I also need to do a lot more of), T.O.S. (The Other Sam) said it beautifully:

The art develops the uniqueness of the product and the craftsmanship the quality.

Click to expand...

I'm one of the many who envies the art skills that you and the others have built up, often before you started engraving. Those of you who learned in traditional ways were (mostly) working hard on those art skills during the years you were getting your engraving technique honed. Us newbies, with the air-assist, get jumped ahead on the engraving technique and often find our art skills falling behind, at least in proportion to those with the traditional training.

As to computer-assisted drawing, there I think we have the opposite situation - it takes enough effort to master the computer program that it gets in the way of developing your art. There the advantage is to those who have already spent the time learning those programs. I may not be great with getting a pencil to give me the drawing that's in my head, but it's not the pencil itself I'm fighting with.

Carlos and I aren't trying to learn everything, we're just trying to get enough of a handle on things that we can hope to come close to being able to do some of the wonderous things we see you guys do.

Right Carlos?

Don't listen to Brian. Hand engraving is too hard and takes too much time. Besides, what satisfaction could there possibly be in creating a work of art with 10$ worth of tools?

Steve,


You WILL be able to do those things... but my personal experience is that this particular field is not one in which I ever found much in the way of "instant gratification". Perhaps for you guys it can be different?

I just try to take some of the bumps (hills/mountains) out of the road, and show you which bumps (hills/mountains) you may not be able to avoid and still get to the destination. One of them is drawing.

If you build a nice building and you want it to be around a while, you pay attention to constructing the foundation. Otherwise, cracks will appear and eventually the rest of the construction will start showing serious flaws... and perhaps fall apart.


There are only two ways to draw that I am aware of. Manually holding the pencil/pen/scribe, or manually entered/drawn on keyboards & pads assisted by computer programs.

I have both pencils and the Illustrator computer program. At the moment I am still way faster with the pencil and pretty discouraged with the computer for speed and ease of use.

If there are more ways, I musta missed 'em... Maybe they've figured out how to create drawings through computers using electrodes attached directly to your skull or "seeing" into your mind with some kind of scan. Probably both will soon exist if they aren't reality now.

So at the moment we have only the two available methods to transfer ideas and designs into reality? Gettin proficient at either or both of them, I think - will help smooth the way...


If you are gifted in other ways, for example sculpting - I have seen sculptors just look at their material and go. No drawings of any kind. Pure mental image. Like magic.

Probably partially how Jim Kelso's mind can produce his amazing work without much in the way of detailed drawings beforehand?

Most of us don't have that ability (I certainly don't) and have to use these cruder methods until something better comes along.


Brian


Leonard, you are skipping your treatment again...

I'll give an example:
A few years ago I got interested in lure fishing..like a kid in a candy store I kept buying all kinds of lures.
Once I had over a 100 great looking lures laid out on a table & posted a pic on a lure forum.
One of the old hands pointed out that as lovely as they are, I'd never use most of them (& didn't need)...
Of course I tried them all, but eventually I realized what he meant... Half a dozen was plenty & they were replaced when lost...the rest are still almost in mint condition looking pretty in a box..somewhere.

Do you see the comparison?

I've also been thrashed at the pool table by an old pro using a bent & broken tipped cue (while I used his custom made predator)...so great tools are only as good as you work them.

Maybe putting your funds towards a class that would actually propel you forward alot quicker ?
Though: I know that's abit tricky if you have youngsters ( which is why I haven't done it) , but your cash is better use elsewhere than random toy shopping IMHO.

It's abit like ignoring parental advice...till you realise.

I do like opening parcels of new toys myself (don`t we all), so I totally understand trying to find every excuse to justify them

Christmas in Oktober:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mathematical_joke#Jokes_with_numeral_bases
Martin

KC Steve

yes

Chris,

Thats exactly one of the things I need to buy (wink) a class nex year.

Saludos,

Carlos

dlilazteca said:

Thats exactly one of the things I need to buy (wink) a class nex year.
Saludos,
Carlos

Click to expand...

Hoorah!
Just save that cash & ignore the tool catalogue. Ok?

Carlos: Looking at your post of 10/24 of the knife you're working on now, I would say that you need more work on the art side than the cutting side. And that's normally the case with everyone who engraves (myself included) so don't take that the wrong way.

I admire your enthusiasm and perseverance for our art. If you were my student your assignment would be to fill sketchbook pages with scroll designs. Turn off that giant television and get into right-brain mode and pour yourself into learning design. Study the book DRAWING ON THE RIGHT SIDE OF THE BRAIN by Betty Edwards. Look at the work of Sam W., Phil Coggan, Ron Smith, Winston Churchill, etc. Those cats are badass designers. Yeah, they can cut but there's no magic in their engraving technique. The magic is in their brilliant design work. If their cutting was half as good as it is their work would still be world class because the design would carry it.

Yep, having that TV going while you are learning to draw... or engrave - or even trying to think - is more than I would ever be able to do.

Picture a surgeon or tattooist watching a game whilst carving (engraving) on your body... better yet - picture the results.


Brian

Will practice drawing more, for sure

Saludos,

Carlos

To Martin's post:

Ha-ha ;-)

In my post above I did not want to imply that drawing is not essential, or that work flows effortlessly from my fingertips. Maybe I live a little more in my imagination than some so that drawing for me is often a kind of reconciliation between imagination and what can actually be hacked into material, rather than a way to develop(synthesize) a design from a simple starting point. Drawing is absolutely essential and everyone will have a little different way to utilize it. I use it in various ways depending on the project. Drawing practice will never be wasted.

I do also develop some designs that are more synthesized from elements such as the attached drawing for a tsuba. I’ve actually reworked this design but don’t want to show it until the piece is finished. It does show that with some pieces I develop a fairly fully realized drawing before starting, and I realized while writing this that this is the way I mostly worked until fairly recently.

Also shown is a sketch and notebook jammed with concept drawings and notes. The notes break down into categories of: 1) types of objects(boxes, knives, etc.) 2) design motifs(plants, animals, landscape, etc), 3)techniques. Technique to me is always at the service of artistry so is almost never the leading factor, but I like to keep track of new technique that may lend itself to a certain effect.

From time to time I pour through this notebook to see if a project coalesces from the three categories. You can see from the three visible drawings that they are pretty primitive, but enough to trigger my memory(needs more and more trigger).

Here's a fun exercise that I don't do enough.

You know how we all like to cut a copy of one of the lovely designs we see here, just to get a feel for it? If you want something that I find more difficult, try to draw a copy of one.

You need to have tools that are good enough not to get in your way. The better you are, the better you can do with poor tools. Really good tools do (IMHO) help out at the beginning.

But Brian is right in that you have to be able to draw. Isn't it always said here that "a great design poorly cut will always look better than a poor design beautifully cut"?

Some of the best advice I ever got was from Mark Hoescht. Much like Sam just put it, "Good design will carry fair engraving, The best engraving will not hide poor design."
I took that to heart. I rarely pick up a graver now except to execute a job or to do the practice work for that job.
I would also be wary of working up designs on the actual piece you are going to cut. Your excited brain will tell you to cut long before the design is ready for that. These days I work off of outlines of the knife/gun etc, and quite often I'll cut parts of the design on a practice plate first in order to be sure of how the design will look when cut. Just because a design looks good on paper, it may look awful when cut. I just don't have the experience to know with certainty beforehand how a piece will look once shaded with a graver.
I advise picking a simple knife like you have in the outline, do a few designs and post them here for critique. There's a lot of experience and wisdom here.
I admire your tenacity and work ethic! Keep it up.