Question: Understanding Scrolls or Advanced Scrolls book?

[Daniel Isdell]

Greetings,

I have been trying to find a used copy of Understanding Scrolls by Ron Smith and no one seems to be willing to part with their copy. (Good testament to the book:thumbs up Another forum user suggested that I skip "Understanding Scrolls" and get a copy of "Advanced Scrolls" also by Ron Smith. I was told that Advanced Scrolls starts off with basics and goes to advanced and that much of the same material is covered. So what do you guys think? Should I skip the first one?

Anybody have a beat up copy of either book that they want to sell inexpensively?

Thanks,

Dan

 

[Dave London]

YES get the new book:thumbs up:

 

[DakotaDocMartin]

They are still available for purchase from a couple of places:

Contenti Jewelry Making Supplies:
Drawing and Understanding Scroll Designs

GRS Tools:
Drawing & Understanding Scroll Designs

 

[Daniel Isdell]

Thanks Dave, any specifics about the reasons?

Doc, I am trying to find used because of financial issues. I figure SOMEONE must be done with their copy or maybe getting out of engraving. I can hope anyway... I just need to keep the costs down for now. But thanks,

Dan

 

[GertGraveur]

You'll see the book is worth it's price, in fact mr Smith's "laws" for drawing scrolls makes drawing them easier, even for non-artist like myself. In my opinion Ron Smith's books are a must have, like a graver and metal, you'll need it to proceed.

Gert

 

[Arnaud Van Tilburgh]

I have both books, the first one is basic yes, but it also explains it all. The first one is a lot cheaper too. And in my opinion there is enough information in that smaller book. And you know, sometimes less is more as too much information does not always makes it more clear.
Never the less, Advanced Scrolls is a nice book.

arnaud

 

[pilkguns]

We see a lot of new people on this forum who put up scroll designs for critique that are way too complicated, often drawing somethng way beyond their understanding because they have not done the basic drawing. I have not done a survey, per se, but several of us long time engravers have discussed this phenemona and seems to be the consensus that the beginners only have Ron's Advanced book, because it is the newest.

 

[Daniel Isdell]

Thanks Gert, Arnaud, and Scott,

That is how I felt about it. I like to have a good grounding in the basics of what ever I undertake, which is why I am fixated on getting a copy of the Understanding Scrolls book. I have seen some excerpts here and there and SOOO many people refering to it's principals that I know it must be THE essential book on the subject. If I don't get a used copy in the next few days I am going to go ahead and bite the bullet and buy a copy. But I will still be looking fo a used copy of the Advanced Scolls book. (heck $75 is about 1/10 of a Lindsay Artisan Airgraver) so I need to pinch my pennies really hard!

Thanks again for the input

Dan Isdell

Creator of the Celtic Knot Font
http://www.clanbadge.com

 

[Andrew Biggs]

You can buy all 3 Ron Smith books here from FEGA.

Cheers
Andrew

 

[Daniel Isdell]

Hi Andrew,

Thanks for replying. However, this issue is not finding the books, the issue is paying for them. Times are hard here and I have a lot of huge medical bills for my wife fighting cancer plus I have to work from home to take care of her. So for me, if I can find an unwanted used copy at a discounted price that is best for me. I just found a copy of the first book through interlibrary loan and it should be delivered to the local library for me in a couple of days. So I am still looking for a used copy of the second book "Advance Scroll Design"

That having been said, I was unaware of the third book, and at just $10, I think that I will get that one new! (after I have read and worked through the first two books). What can you tell me about the third book?

Thanks again,

Dan Isdell

Creator of the Celtic Knot Font
http://www.clanbadge.com

 

[Andrew Biggs]

HI Daniel

Book 1: Drawing and understanding scroll designs.......covers scroll and leaf structures.

Book 2: More on scroll design..............is a follow up from Ron's 1995 FEGA seminar and mainly is about leaf structure.

Book 3: Advanced drawing of scrolls .....has all of the above and a whole lot more.

Cheers
Andrew

 

[Roger Bleile]

Dan,

Perhaps you may eventually find a used copy of the book for sale by someone who gave up on engraving. For your sake I hope so. For most of us we hang onto our books like we do our tools (in a sense the books are tools). They are not only a reference but we like to have them handy for loan to those we are giving personal instruction to.

In my case I hope to find a good repository for my books in my estate. I have no intention of ever seling them. I suspect that I am not alone in this.

Cheers,

Roger

 

[Andrew Biggs]

Roger............Even the idea of selling a book is enough to bring on a migraine!!!

I'm still trying to figure out how I can take them with me

Cheers
Andrew

 

[Christopher Malouf]

No books or tools ever loaned and whatever you have accumulated when you die ... always goes to auction after you're gone. Why? ... because no matter how cool you thought your engraving stuff was, your family and/or kids prefer to convert it all into cheap electronics and computer games.

Look for books on auctionzip.com

 

[Roger Bleile]

Hey Chris,

Make sure you pass on that Dore' book to a worthy successor before they pull the plug on you. It may be a contradiction that, though I won't sell my books I did give one away to someone who I knew would appreciate it.:thumbs up:

Roger

 

[pilkguns]

Yesterday, I was at Jim Hall's house giving him an engraving lesson. (Jim is the pig cooker at the Engrave-In). Several time in the last few months, I have been looking for my original copy of American Engravers, that I purchased back in 1982, signed by Roger as the author before i bought it and again a few years ago when we first met because of this forum. It also has a lot of tore out pages of magazines of various engraving articles over the years, plus my notes and tape pieces of where I used it to copy scrolls or patterns as I was learning. I had been looking for it pretty serious a couple of times for students that were coming by here but never found it and figured it was under a pile somehere, or even some nagging concern that someone would have absconded with it from the Engrave-IN. Need I say that this book is a part of my life? I would seriously hate to loose THAT copy. Anyway, yesterday I was at Jim's and there it was by his bench, I had took it to him last time I was there back in the spring. If there was anyone I might have actually loaned it to it would be JIm, but i had totally forgot I had taken it here.

I did bring it home with me.

 

[Marcus Hunt]

Dan, I'm sorry to hear about your wife and wish her a swift recovery. As Roger says, most of us tend to hang on to books like this and unless someone who has one is giving up engraving completely you could be in for an extremely long wait.

But, please don't forget Ron who has put huge efforts into creating this "must have". Most of us would not have the patience to write a book like this and he has put huge amounts of himself into it. I'm sure he wouldn't mind me saying this but Ron is not a hugely wealthy man and he has had his own hurdles to jump with the loss of his thumb a few years ago. $75 might seem like a lot of money for a book but Ron will not earn that from the sale of one copy. For the wealth of knowledge Ron has parted with to create this book it does seem a bit cheap to try and bum a copy off of someone else. Some might feel it's okay to burn a copy of a Hollywood DVD but if you do that to one of the engraving instructional DVD's you are hurting an individual by denying them recompense for the knowledge they are sharing with you. In other words you are cheating them. If Ron was willing to gift you a copy, that's fine, it's his prerogative; but trying to get something for free for personal gain doesn't seem right to me. Sometimes in this life you have to speculate in order to accumulate and, in this case, spending on the book will bring you a wealth of knowledge. If you have to sacrifice something to gain that knowledge you will appreciate it far more than if it's given to you on a plate.

I'm not trying to tell you off or make you feel bad, all I'm saying is spare a thought for the person you will be denying whilst you try to get the knowledge for nothing.

 

[JJ Roberts]

scroll book

Dan,You can't go wrong with Ron's book Advanced Scaolls.:thumbs up:I wish this book was around when started engraving. J.J. :yes

 

[pilkguns]

amen Marcus

 

[Daniel Isdell]

trying to get something for free for personal gain doesn't seem right to me.

Marcus,

I NEVER asked for someone to GIVE me a copy. I only asked if someone has a used or beat up or a discounted copy. I completely understand the value of this "must have" work which is why I am trying so hard to get a one for myself. I have heard of so many people speak so highly of it that I consider it absolutely esential to my education as an engraver.

I did not ask anyone to make me a copy, I make my living selling software and I do not make copies of hollywood DVDs or engraving DVDs and the only books I have bought in the last four years have been used books. I did not ask for anything for free. I do not think that $75 dollars is a lot for this book. But I am not in a hurry to get it either. I have already found a copy of "Drawing and Understanding Scrolls" from interlibrary loan service and that will suffice for now because I can not even afford $39.95

I will buy a copy when I can but for now I would be making a choice of buying a book when I can not even afford to pay for my wife's cancer meds or to replace the badly slipping clutch in my car or to pay my back rent. I just had to move out of my home of 11 years because I can no longer afford it, so I don't think that I am wrong to try to find a used copy of a book.

I think that you need to go back and read ALL of my posts before you make an accusation like that. It is unfounded and I do resent it.

Daniel Isdell
Creator of the Celtic Knot Font
http:www.clanbadge.com