Is it just me?

Is it just me or is brass a PITA to cut?. Likely 90% of what I cut is brass and I get along reasonably fine with it. Then I go and cut mild steel and it's wonderfull. Then I go back to brass and it sucks. It's like I have to learn all over again. Is it just me or is there something about brass that makes it less forgiving?.

Cody

Hi Cody.
No, it's not just you.
Brass can be great or terrible to cut.
As you know, it's a mixture of copper and nickel and sometimes other things.
There are just a lot of different grades of brass.
A lot of it is reclaimed stuff and has a lot of inclusions in it.
For years, metal merchants were gathering up WW2 shell cases from the dirt of battlefields and melting them down.
Not all of this was very well cleaned before melting.
Cast brass usually cuts differently than rolled brass, and so on.
Most clean cold rolled steel is pretty nice to cut, but there are different grades in it too.
Try to make a couple of test cuts in hidden places to check it out.
On guns I will often make a small cut on the inside of the action to get an idea of what I am letting myself in for.
John B.

Cody,
I usually dip the tip of my graver in "TAP MAGIC ALUMINUM" it is some kind of oil that lubricate the cut while engraving, it works good on brass.
You can buy it from GRS.
George

Brass

John B
Thank You ,Thank You, Thank You I thought is was just me and lousy techinque. Your insight and information is priceless. Hope to meet you one day.Dave
I made a lot of bad noises the metal was soft,hard,voids & gummy, Will be more carefull next time

Thanks John. I've hit voids in cast brass, sometimes a nice sweeping cut falls into a giant sand filled crater that was just under the surface. That really sucks. Like Dave, I thought it was just me and lousy technique. Although, with me, it likely IS that as well as the annomolies found in the brass.
George, I'll get some of that tap magic and give it a go. Thanks

Cody

Tap Magic is a cutting fluid. There are several kinds and the aluminum is a different formula tehn what is used for steel when cutting or taping. You should be able to find it in welding shops or other stores that sell mechanic tools. Not likely to find it in the standard hardware store. The aluminum Tap Magic is lighter than the type for steel, etc.

http://www.tapmagic.com/

Grainger sells the aluminum in a 16 oz can for $8.78. http://www.grainger.com/Grainger/wwg/itemDetailsRender.shtml?ItemId=1611746998

Cool. Thanks Kevin

You can put a small piece of sponge in a bottle cap and soak it with the Tap Magic and then dip the graver in it. That's the method I've seen. If you get a 16 oz can it should last a long, long time.

Hi Cody,
You should try brass's nasty cousin, Palladium White Gold.It is
the most miserable stuff I've ever tried to cut. The only thing that helps
is tap magic. I like using the tap magic for steel. It's thicker and last
on the cutting edge a little longer.
Pall W/G resistance to sheer is pretty high. I suppose 950 Pall. will
be even worse. I had two wedding band blanks in my stock box that
I've been putting off just because the stuff is so bad. Looks like I'm going to
have to bite the bullet in January and get them done.

Cutting Fluid

Cody and anyone else, being in the aerospace industry we have some pretty cool stuff. I use this product called BOELUBE. It was created by BOEING AC and is an awsome fluid. I use it for all my cutting applications. The solid for my saw blades, the liquid for my gravers, screws and taps etc., and the past for all my wood screws. Below is the website that it can be ordered from if you so choose.

http://www.yardstore.com/index.cfm?Action=ViewCategory&Category=9

Thanks Yves that website is great.

Gentlemen,
I'm gonna chime in here too, tools have to be xtra sharp to cut brass, copper, aluminum. When I machined these metals on multiple spindle (screwmachines)for 20yrs.I learned this: you will grind your tools twice as often with the non-ferrous metals. You can file brass with a new file all day, switch to filing steel then go back to brass & the file is basically ruined and wont cut it . A machine tool that has cut steel all day long without change then has to cut brass, well, it ain't happenin'. The lube does help but the brass etc, will knock the edge off your gravers/chisels like nobodys business. So , if you cut brass & go to steel you will probably be ok, but the other way around will be trouble.
I like Jergens tool aid or Aluma cut for / especially bright cutting, Jergens & aluma cut are a bit heavier & stick to the graver better imho.
best,
Kent

My very first PAID engraving job was a brass belt buckle that the owner wanted monogramed. I had cut plenty of brass practice plates so I didn't think twice about it. Well, the buckle was cast brass, and my graver was very unpredictable and would bury itself into the metal frequently. This was my first lesson in the unpredictability of engraving cast metal. Rolled brass is fine, but cast brass (as well as other cast metals) can be full of surprises.

Speaking of aluminum, E.C. Prudhomme told me that he used kerosene as a graver lube to help get brighter cuts in aluminum.

~Sam

JimZim
I am a jeweler/engraver. I'm wondering if you could elaborate on the problems of palladium engraving since according to all the publications this will be very prominent in our industry in the near future.

I will try to explain. I have engraved a lot of different type of metal.
Let start with sterling silver. On a scale of 1 to 10 one being a metal that
is easy to engrave. Sterling is around a 4.

18k yellow is a 1. It simply does what you ask it to do. It's a fast cutting metal.

90/10 Platinum is a 1.It simply does what you ask it to do. Slightly stiffer
than 18k yellow.

Cold rolled steel is a 2. It is possible to get very fine detail that hold up to
cleaning. It will snap off if your lifting it out of a bright cut. There is a good
feel to the resistance it give the engraver.

14k yellow gold is a 3. This is conditional on the alloy. It does what you
ask it to. It has more resistance than 18k and require more care be taken
in execution. Still a fast cut.

Sterling silver is a 4. This is a soft metal. Easy to over cut. More of a metal
for hand cutting. Almost no resistance to the tool. To fast of a cut.

14k white gold with nickel alloy is a 5. about 50% stiffer than 14k yellow.
You can get nice meets of bright cutting. Stiff, but a moderate cut speed.

Brass is similar to 14k white gold, also stainless steel.

Nickel silver is a 6. Resist the graver. Drags through cuts.

95/5 Platinum with cobalt alloy is a 6. Resist being bent.

18k White gold with nickel alloy is a 7. Hard, brittle at time, with nickel spots in some mixes.
Resist being pushed with a beader. It can cut well in bright cutting some times.

14k white gold with palladium alloy is a 8. Resist the graver. It's like
trying to dig in frozen ground. If your trying to lift it out of a bright cut
it holds on. In other words, resistance to sheer is high.

950 Pure Palladium is a 8 1/2 . Same as above just add 30%

The worst is case hardened. It's a 10

This is how I think of it. Not very scientific, and there's a lot I've left out.
Yes,you save move on Palladium per ounce but if it takes twice a long to set
it, how much have you really saved. In my opinion it's a pain to have to
set a ring that fights back so hard.
I just may have to get over it though, and get on with the job.
Jim

Thanks Jim
That actually helped me allot. I never thought about those metals in that perspective before.
David

Thanks Jim
Excellent info.

I use tap magic when I engrave pewter also it works very good.
George

Jim: That's an excellent post. Thanks for the valuable info on various metals.